I wouldn't do any root pruning now if the tree is in full leaf. The rule of thumb that a local nursery uses here is 10" of root ball diameter for every inch of caliper (taken at 6" above the root flare).
hortster

Oh really? What was the ID on that tree?

Don't do anything to it right now. Wait until after leaf drop and then do your digging while getting as much of the rootball as possible (both vertically and horizontally). On a 7 ft tree I would try around 2'x2' and make sure you water it in whenever it gets dry the first year or two at the new location.

That 10" per inch guideline would likely result in a less than ANSI standard sized rootball on this tree (too small). I'd go with at least a standard sized ball, if not larger.

Ideally, if root pruning was going to be done, it should have already have been done. Some root pruning now might help, but I have mixed feelings about it (there are positives and negatives).

the thought is .. that stressing the heck out of it now .. is not going to help it.. when you stress the heck out of it with actual transplant in fall ...

forget about the tap root issue .... its just another root ...

check out the pic for moving a 7 - 9 foot cherry ... and i have done the same with many oak seedlings ...

do the deed when the leaves fall off the other trees... or when they color ... all trees will be dormant above by then ...

or in spring around 4/1 ... lol.. look at the date on the pic ....

ken

{{gwi:325678}}

brandon7, you are correct. I should have looked before I leaped. Attached are the ANSI standards. And, I know that at that nursery they used to put a larger rootball on oaks than for other trees and had better transplant success. Also note that collected trees (as this one might be considered) need a larger rootball yet.
hortster
{{gwi:368588}}

Use the "Type 1" chart for this tree.
__________________________________

"forget about the tap root issue .... its just another root ..."

In some small sense, there is some truth in that statement, but generally I'd say it's just wrong.

I'm with Ken. The taproot is NOT a magical thing.
It's mainly a 'reserve energy storage vessel' of sorts, so, when digging a strongly-taprooted species, it's best to preserve as much as is possible - just so the tree will have more to call upon for re-establishing root system and pushing leaves; but it's not a death warrant to cut it. Cutting the taproot causes no more stress to the tree than cutting any other similar-sized root.

I bare-root and transplant oaks/pecans/hickories similar in size to the cherry that ken showed the photo of, all the time. Yes, I try to get at least 16-20" or more of taproot, but if they come out with only 10-12", it's not the end of the world.

"Cutting the taproot causes no more stress to the tree than cutting any other similar-sized root."

It's hard to know how to easily address that statement because reality is just more complex than that. First, most oak taproots grow very differently than lateral roots. Taproots are much more short and stubby than similar sized lateral roots. Young naturally-grown oaks may not have any roots as large as their taproot and a large percentage of the root system may radiate from the taproot. The trees depend on the taproot for support and to reach moisture. As the trees grow, the taproots become less dominant but are often retained as a storage organ.

Oaks (most, anyway) can be pretty forgiving of taproot pruning, but that doesn't mean the taproot is unimportant (or of equal importance to similarly sized roots). In fact, if this were the case, the efforts and money going into research on how best to handle taproot development in container grown trees would be of no real meaning. The roots would just be chopped off without much thought when the trees were planted.

Can oaks be successfully transplanted with significant loss of taproot material? Definitely. Does the taproot make most oak species more sensitive to transplant than many other types of trees? Without a doubt. There is no need to be afraid to remove part of the taproot, but simply ignoring it's significance is not likely to lead to better transplanting results.

"forget about the tap root issue .... its just another root ..."

In some small sense, there is some truth in that statement, but generally I'd say it's just wrong.

=-==>>> what i mean.. he does not have to excavate the entire taproot to 22 feet because it is some magical premium root..

it is simply another root on the tree.. and should be cut to a length consistent with the rest of the severed roots ... its just part of the root mass ... IT IS NOT MAGICAL...

the tap.. simply held the acorn long enough for the sprout to form and grow skyward.. until other roots anchored it to the ground ...

i maintain.. IT IS NOT MAGICAL ... treat it like any other ...

i mean really.. are you suggesting a 30 inch bare root group of roots .. and a 5 foot excavation of the tap??? if it really goes that far .. i presume not ... correct me if i am wrong ...

when forming the ball.. or barerooting.. its just another root ...

ken

I know we ended up cross-posting Ken. You are right about not excavating a 5' of taproot! Some species are more sensitive to transplant than others, and some oaks have no taproot at all (at least after their seedling stage). With naturally-grown oaks (ones without early taproot modification/removal) and even (maybe to a smaller degree) with established, once-container-grown oaks, I'd just recommend a rootball a little deeper than an normal. In other words, don't go nuts (or acorns), but also don't just completely disregard the taproot.

Pop it out bare-rooted at a suitable time of the year, getting as much root as possible instead of trying to make and move an intact soil ball. The tree wants to keep all its roots, the closer you come to this state the less stunting of the top there will be the following spring.

Okay, I am a complete noob but seem to have a decent green thumb. I lost a big maple in my front yard and was pondering what to replace it with.

Then a red oak seedling popped up in my peony bed last year, so I just let it alone and now it is about 5 ft tall, 3 inches around the trunk at the bottom.

When should I transplant it (about 50 feet from present location), and how big a rootball should I try for? Also, it will be from slightly lower shaded site to higher, full sun, is that alright?

hey barb ...

start you own post... and include some pix ...

i can NOT.. in any way . think about digging a 3 inch caliper tree by hand.. hoiking it out of the 3 to 4 foot hole .. and dragging it 50 feet away ...

we are talking a 3 to 4 foot.. couple hundred pound root mass ...

its not worth it... IMHO .... just buy a new one.. and cut this one down.. since it sounds too close to the house ...

but a pic might change my mind. ..

look forward to your new post ... include where you are... and your soil type ...

ken

OK, I explained that I am NOT a professional. Maybe I misled by saying 3 inches? That would be the diameter of the trunk a few inches above the soil.

No need to be so patronizing to someone who admits to being ignorant and is requesting help, asshole.

Barbara in case you were unaware you just hijacked this thread....its considered rude on any forum to ask a question unrelated to the original post. But anyway regarding your question I would say go for it. Dig it up when all the leaves fall off and make sure you get as much of the root as possible. Expect it to grow slowly for a couple years until it recovers.

Barbara Danley's post is perfectly consistent with the original post. I would advise her to ignore and scroll past all the schoolmarm's comments. I have great admiration for posters asking for transplanting advice since the transplanted tree will give you great satisfaction in the years to come. If you see someone responding with the "lazy man's" advice just scroll on by. BD's red oak seedling as described should be no problem whatsoever to dig. Use a spade, form the ball by digging down and around. Use Hortster's chart for ball size (earlier on this thread). Pin a burlap on the ball while still in the hole. Take your spade and cut immediately under the ball to sever the root(s). Remove the intact ball and plant in its new home. If you prefer to dig it bareroot I would say about the last week in March. Dig like above but no burlap. You will still have to sever the root(s) with the spade, no way to avoid that. BTW oaks this size and larger are routinely moved bareroot in March.

"and (why) does where I live or type of soil have to do with advising me NOT to do something?"

Location (especially in regards to climate) and soil type are two KEY factors in just about any horticultural endeavor. Climate should be considered in determining the best time to move the tree. It may also influence the likelihood of success in moving the tree. Soil type is absolutely critical. It will have a big influence on how large the rootball, or remaining root structure, should be. Root systems develop very differently in fast-draining soil compared to slower-draining soils. The type of soil will also impact the weight of the rootball and how easily the rootball can be moved without damage (if that method is desired).

re Ken's comment regarding difficulty versus size

Ken was looking at this from a "homeowner" perspective. Not everything that can be done should be done, and not everyone would be capable of moving a tree this size by themselves. If you are determined to do it, it is do-able. BUT, be prepared for a good deal of work. It's not a task for just anyone.

"WTF"

Ken is not a "noob". He may oversimplify things at times, or come across a little differently than the "average" poster, but discounting his input would often be a mistake only a noob would make. Patients, careful consideration, and civilized discourse are usually valuable resources here on GardenWeb.

I am well aware of how those issues could affect my efforts-but Ken advised me not to evenmtry it, so, yeah, pointless.

He made it clear what an "expert" he is, after I made it clear I am not. However, I have a 6 goot tall tangerine tree grown from seeds out of a fruit, 15 years old, I may have some small talent.

Lastly, if this transplant fails, I am out exactly zero except lack of a tree and my labor-big deal. But I would like it to succeed, which would be why I asked for advice. So far, sam is the only responder who has not been condescending or critical and also the only person who has tried to be helpful. Thanks, sam. The rest of you old maids can go back to whatever it is you do for fun.

Barbara, in my opinion, the communications problem you seem to be having is almost entirely because of your inconsiderate approach.

Take a couple deep breaths. We're-even Ken, lol-mostly here to help. I know I have no other reason to be popping in here all the time, not that I've provided any input here thus far. But yeah, most of us regular posters here actually do know what we're talking about.

+oM