So, I was looking at a few other posts, and came across this one...
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/trees/msg061344518392.html?9

Which had a link to this one;
http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/howtos/ht_dednecrosis/ht_dednecrosis.htm

I did a google image search on the bugs listed, and none of them resemble what they look like.

Just a followup. Again, thanks!

Doubt the ants or other "bugs" you are seeing had anything to do with it. I'm sorry, but the tree is dead and any treatment and far excessive watering you are doing is wasted. From what I can tell from the first picture is that the tree is planted too deep to begin with, then mulch up to the trunk (another no no), and then something else came along and finished it off. If it was container grown, then I would bet that it has strangling roots that was the final blow.

Nothing to do but start over, and learn about proper planting and mulching, and root girdling.

Arktrees

Hello ARKTREES and thank you for the reply. I was afraid someone was going to tell me that it was dead right off the bat. A few follow ups to your post though,

When planted, the base of the rootball sat about two inches higher than the native soil. Should it be even higher than that?

In regards to the mulch, it has never been mulched up to the trunk. The trunk has a diameter of 20" at the base, mulch has always been kept 3-4" away from actually touching the base. Should it be farther than that?

It is a container tree, yes, and when planted, the rootball was cut in multiple sections and separated to try and prevent it from happening. To my knowledge, that's the best preventative to root girdling.

I do appreciate your reply and advice. I do though, think its a bit condescending to tell me to flat out learn something with the assumption that I know nothing from the gate. No, I'm obviously not a master gardener, which is why I joined to ask questions. To be honest, had I known this is the type of reply I would have received before joining, I probably wouldn't have to begin with. I apologize if I took your response the wrong way, but it did come off to be quite supercilious.

Wallace,
Sounds like you did what you were supposed to do, but with that IMHO, it is likely girdled. 20" circumference tree in a container probable has lots of root issues deeper into the rootball that scoring the outside can't correct. And IF that was in fact the case, then it was probable beyond fixing at by the time you got it I learned the hard way myself). As for planting etc, the pic is small, but I see no sign of the root flare which says too deep and is the only thing I have to go on. Maybe it's there but difficult to see in your picture. And it certainly appears to have mulch to the trunk, again it's a small picture but all I had to go on. You mentioned nothing of planting procedure etc. Lastly, it's late June with bark falling off, and your not sure of the prognosis. Everything I had to go on, strongly suggested you were un-familar with the above concepts as are the great majority of new posters here. So yes from what I had to go on, you needed to educate yourself in specific areas, and stated what those areas were. Same post, same circumstances I would do so again, and continue to try to help you. No offense was intended. I try to help people here because I want to do so, and my posts are almost always hurried because I am taking time from something else or am distracted (like now with a pet bird running around on me trying to get my keyboard).

With all that said, hopefully your other trees will not meet the same end. I do suggest you dig this one up and take some pictures of what you find so that we can try to diagnose what happened.

Arktrees

Hey Arktrees,

I apologize for the delay here, and thank you for your clarification. I know things in text can definitely be misunderstood, I'm glad that was the case.

So, I have consulted a few others in person about this tree since my original post.

First, my friend that I referenced in my original post is actually a garden employee at the local Home Depot. Has been for years and knows his way around plants. I believe he is Florida Nurseryman Certified, but dont quote me on that. He suggested I give it some more time and see what happens.

Second, I stopped at the Lowe's by me. I brought in some (better) pictures, explained what had been done and asked for help. They suggested a UFO landed and sucked the sapwood dry. Not really, but their answer was useless and suggested I put 10-10-10 on it. I find that my local Lowe's is hit-or-miss on knowledge, so their answer, sadly, didn't surprise me.

Third, I stopped at a local nursery and again explained the situation to the lady, who happened to be both the owner and an arborist. She actually came by to look at it, which, in my book, was a win. Her verdict? It isn't dead, but it's getting there. She gave the survival chances to be 30%. She couldn't say for 100% certainty, but it was likely the carpenter ants. They seem to have built quite a massive nest under and within the rootball, causing the root system to fail, allowing for bigger problems. This made sense, as she dumped a 5 gallon bucket of water on it and, sure enough, it rushed underground, exposing some massive air holes in the root system. She suggested I put a hose on it twice a week for about 30 minutes, and if I didn't see any progress within a month, it was a goner. She also pointed out some branches to trim off so that the tree wasn't internally trying to save its entire system, allowing it to focus on just a few select branches.

So, I've spent the evening trimming and hopefully it'll show me some love in return. I'll post a followup in a month when I know if it's going to come back or not.

One quick correction though, its 20" in circumference, not diameter, I apologize. And for what its worth, it was less than an inch around when I bought it. Three gallon container at Home Depot.

Again, thanks for your advice and followup. I hope you get those birds under control.

Hey Arktrees,

I apologize for the delay here, and thank you for your clarification. I know things in text can definitely be misunderstood, I'm glad that was the case.

So, I have consulted a few others in person about this tree since my original post.

First, my friend that I referenced in my original post is actually a garden employee at the local Home Depot. Has been for years and knows his way around plants. I believe he is Florida Nurseryman Certified, but dont quote me on that. He suggested I give it some more time and see what happens.

Second, I stopped at the Lowe's by me. I brought in some (better) pictures, explained what had been done and asked for help. They suggested a UFO landed and sucked the sapwood dry. Not really, but their answer was useless and suggested I put 10-10-10 on it. I find that my local Lowe's is hit-or-miss on knowledge, so their answer, sadly, didn't surprise me.

Third, I stopped at a local nursery and again explained the situation to the lady, who happened to be both the owner and an arborist. She actually came by to look at it, which, in my book, was a win. Her verdict? It isn't dead, but it's getting there. She gave the survival chances to be 30%. She couldn't say for 100% certainty, but it was likely the carpenter ants. They seem to have built quite a massive nest under and within the rootball, causing the root system to fail, allowing for bigger problems. This made sense, as she dumped a 5 gallon bucket of water on it and, sure enough, it rushed underground, exposing some massive air holes in the root system. She suggested I put a hose on it twice a week for about 30 minutes, and if I didn't see any progress within a month, it was a goner. She also pointed out some branches to trim off so that the tree wasn't internally trying to save its entire system, allowing it to focus on just a few select branches.

So, I've spent the evening trimming and hopefully it'll show me some love in return. I'll post a followup in a month when I know if it's going to come back or not.

One quick correction though, its 20" in circumference, not diameter, I apologize. And for what its worth, it was less than an inch around when I bought it. Three gallon container at Home Depot.

Again, thanks for your advice and followup. I hope you get those birds under control.

Wallace,
No worries. No apology for anything is needed. One must have a relatively "even" demeanor for the WWW.

As for your tree, I don't know about "Carpenter Ants", though I still find it hard to believe that they would be an issue at least unless there was already some other problem. Just the same, I defer to local knowledge and hands on examination, and I certainly no expert on Florida. In the end it probable really doesn't matter, as the next planting season is months away anyway, and you should have a definitive answer by then. In the time in between, you could scout out a replacement. Looking at species, sizes, locating, and costs.

Hope it works out.

Arktrees

P.S. As for the bird..... cranky little &%$^ has been getting in the middle of what I'm doing and causing trouble, being just a general brat PITA for more than a decade. Cockatoos will always live in the "Terrible Two's" and act like human toddlers. But they are still allot of fun.

This post was edited by arktrees on Tue, Jul 1, 14 at 13:01