last pic ... it is including bark in that weak crotch.. that branch will fail.. in tree terms or years ... could be decades before it happens.. it will usually happen in a weather event ... and it will be catastrophic for the tree ... it probably wont be fixable.. is what i mean ...

everyone is entitled to an opinion ... i cant really weigh them all out.. based on your words alone ...

i dont know about your maturity issue ...

good luck

ken

These are great trees in north Texas, but Ken is spot on about dealing with poor weak branching as they grow - this is a characteristic of these trees. Once they get above 20ft or so, they're pretty good about maintaining a nice oval crown on their own... other than trimming the occasional rubbing branches or "whips" that grow out from the bottom of larger limbs.

We have a lot of these in our part of Dallas which suffered little, if any, damage from the ice storms last winter that tore up a lot of our oaks. My impression is that any reputation for weakness is more likely due to poor branching that was not rectified when the trees were young.

There's also a germ of truth in all of the other objections, so here are some thoughts from our selection and experience with our tree:

• Invasiveness ("produces seedlings") - A legitimate concern in some parts of the country. Nursery industry has dealt with it by producing cloned males. If you bought your tree from a major grower within the last 15 years, I suspect it's most likely male. This is probably the major strike in the male vs female debate. Seems the strength of any arguments for cutting down established female trees would depend a lot on their locations (urban lot vs natural park space, etc.).

• Male vs female - Main arguments for female are the berries, which are attractive while on the tree, and less pollen than the males. Main argument for male is no potentially invasive berries - which probably trumps most other considerations. However, male flowers put out a LOT of pollen, so some concern has been raised over risk of increasing problems for those with sensitivity if/as usage of this tree grows.

• Trashiness - Does not seem that different to me from several other common trees and less than others: pollen is a problem over parked cars, flower/fruit/leaf debris are problems over driveways and pools, etc.

• Consistency/duration of fall color - Not one you mentioned, but something we've seen. There's a lot of variability among the trees in our neighborhood. Some don't ever reach that vivid red, some drop their leaves within a few days of the color change, and others seem to hold onto a good portion of their vibrant red leaves for weeks. Someone planting this tree for a great fall display could be disappointed... even if the tree is otherwise beautiful. Planting a known named cultivar is not an absolute guarantee, but can improve the odds of good fall color.

Thank you very much for your input.

They are used widely here. Incredible fall color.

" Someone planting this tree for a great fall display could be disappointed... even if the tree is otherwise beautiful. Planting a known named cultivar is not an absolute guarantee, but can improve the odds of good fall color."

I have to agree with bostedo. My eight trees will not turn orange to red. The leaves fall off at yellow. My nursery here in NorCal said they might be too protected, not enough temp difference btw night and day for them to turn orange then red. I am very dissappointed as I bought them for the color. Nuts.

Anyone esle having the same problem or have another opinion on no color change?

"last pic ... it is including bark in that weak crotch.."

Maybe Ken sees something that I don't, but even after looking closely at the enlarged version of that picture, I cannot tell that there is any included bark or a weakly attached branch. In fact, the crotch angle looks good and unlikely to produce included bark, to me. I would not bet lots of money either way, based only on that picture, but I don't see any proof of included bark or a weak crotch.

Donna, I have two Keith Davey pistaches that haven't done much at all wrt fall color the three years I have had them. They have gotten a little better each year but nothing special so far. The ones in town get much better color than out in the country where I live as well.