I don't know what you have looked at but I cut across one flat side and then cut up to the neck of the jug. That way I just lift the flap and fill and then put it back down and tape.

Here's mine:

{{gwi:349316}}

I just cut mine like diggerdee, but only leave a hinge below the handle.

diggerdee,what are you using to cut your jugs so nicely with?Looking at yours I think I may have cut mine to high up! I cut along at the same level as the bottom of the handle and left the part where the handle is as my hinge.I wonder if I should change that?

i used to but, then it made it easier to spill, so i decided to experiment and try new way's, this was easier for me, and i don't have to worry about it coming apart. i know later i'll have to redo something to get my plants out. LOL but then again i'm the difficult one!! LOL
but yes!! what are you using!! and what are you using to tape?? or do you guys tape??

Mine look like Dee's too. Cuts not quite as straight, though! Then I close with a small vertical piece of duct tape on each of the 2 front corners. There are big gaps but that hasn't seemed to have any negative effect in the past.

Karen

i also do the same as digger dee.

ok, cool, now could ya'll post some pics of the finished w tape and all?? please :'>>

I cut my jugs like dee also. A ginsu does the job quite neatly. I don't like tape. I used it the first year and didn't like the mess and some of it failed later on. I punch a hole top and bottom opposite the hinge and close it with a twist tie through both holes. I use a hole punch with a little effort, but you could just make the holes the same time you are making your drainage holes if you use a soldering iron.

I am a newbie, but I spent a couple months reading this forum and Wintersown.org trying to figure out what the best containers were, how to prepare them, etc. I'm sure there's some trial and error involved, but I decided on the "flap" method because one of the experts posted a picture of their flap and it looked like it would work well.

So first I punch the holes on the bottom using the awl tool on my Swiss Army knife, which was very quick and easy. A genuine Swiss Army knife has VERY sharp tools and they cut through the milk jug like butter -

{{gwi:349317}}

Then I used the small knife blade to cut the flap. This was also very quick and easy -

{{gwi:349318}}

Then I filled the jug with dirt, sowed the seed, and moistened the soil with a hand pump sprayer. When finished, I put a 3 inch piece of duct tape over the flap to keep it closed.

The flap method seems to work well because it was easy to fill the jug and it basically keeps most of the jug intact, so the jugs stay nice and sturdy when I move them around...which I've done three times already because I keep changing my mind where to put them outside! :)

so love your idea cloud 9!! i'm soooo there!! i have a hole punch but tabor loves to drill holes and it gives him something to do! so i'll let him. i've got plenty of twisty's!
ok i'm gonna try dee's way again and the twisty!!

ohhhh i like terrene, one ? did the person say how it was on getting the seedlings out? see that's what i liked about my idea, the sturdiness, i too move stuff around ALOT!! i am NEVER satisfied!! LOL

terrene...

Are those plant tags by the jug covered with foil tape? I bought some after I heard that the name will "engrave" in the tape, reducing "faded ink" problems as it stays put, but I haven't tried it yet.

Do tell....
Nancy

I do the bottom of my cartons just like Terrene, using my soldering iron. I've tried Deb's way, with the twist tie, but I find it too flimsy when lifting the jugs, so I stuck with the tape (no pun intended, lol!)

I use either duct tape or a cloth tape, and wrap it around the three cut sides.

I thought I had a better picture of my finished, sealed jug, (I KNOW I have one) but I can't find it. So this will have to do.

{{gwi:349319}}

I tried the flap thing too. IMO, a pain in the butt, lol! It kept flapping back up as I tried to sow, and either scraped my arm, or flipped potting mix around, etc. I find it much easier to just cut on three sides and open the jug wide. BTW, I open the jug and then put my scissors through the handle to hold the jug open.

:)
Dee

Oops, forgot to add in answer to a question above - I just use a pair of scissors to cut the jugs. I put a hole in the side of the jug with my soldering iron, and then when I'm ready to sow, I stick the scissor point in the hole, and cut around the jug.

:)
Dee

ok another question then, how about the marking them, i ended up using elaminated paper (we have tons of it- i homeschool so its around LOL) and i used perminant marker- knowing it will fade- i put tape over it and i put it on the inside of the jugs facing the inside of the dirt. now HOPEFULLY this will work!!! not counting on anything.

Medontdo, judging from pictures that experienced sowers posted, it looks like they just cut the flaps off when the weather warms up and it's time to vent the seedlings. After that I figure I'll cut the whole top half off of the jug when it's time to totally harden the seedlings off or transplant.

Nan, yes I used the aluminum tape on popsicle sticks and a ball point pen to kind of engrave the name in the tape. I dunno if this is going to work, but the experts here say it works! It's not the easiest to read, but I already had the tape hanging around and don't have any mini-blinds to use. I also used permanent marker to number each jug on the outside.

Digger, the flaps were pretty easy, although I think cutting it most of the way around like you're doing would make sowing in the jugs a bit easier. I don't want to deal with all that duct tape though!

Using a hand pump sprayer to moisten the soil before and after sowing worked really well - these are the greatest! They spray a nice gentle continuous spray with hardly any effort...

{{gwi:349320}}

I have tried all the various suggestions including cutting the jugs similar to terrene's except cutting the flap as an upside down u. Then the flap lifts to the top. Have even cut the flap completely off making a window then putting a clear bag over the jug. When planting out I either reach in for a HOS or cut the top completely off with my B & D electric scissors. They all work so it's choosing whatever works best for you.

My husband helped me use his electric dremel tool (I think it's called) with a little disk cutter to cut the containers, and then switched to a drill bit to drill the drainage holes. I cut almost all the way around, and then hinged it back. I will use duct tape to secure them back.
I put away all the Christmas decorations finally and cleared alot out of the garage, I bought a great shelf unit from Home Depot and it was (literally) a snap to put together. Now I have my WS supplies a step out the kitchen door into the attached garage. I have bins where I can throw my recycled containers and recycled plastic wrap and I keep some soil there, duct tape, and a marker. It is heavenly!

I guess my method is a combination of the flap method and the cut-across-the-middle method. I wish my digital camera still worked for me to take a picture but it doesn't so I'll try to describe how I do it. Okay, sit the milk jug so the handle is on the right side and towards you. Now over on the left side in the "corner" start about 1" from the top and make a vertical cut about halfway down the jug. Then make a horizontal cut across the top starting from the point of your original cut and cut until you get to the "corner" straight across from where you started to cut. You'd be cutting past a corner and not stopping there but stopping at the next one. If you end up at the handle, you've gone too far! Do the same thing with your second horizontal cut. In other words, you're cutting halfway around the jug starting from where you ended your vertical cut you made in the beginning and ending your cut straight across from where you started this horizontal cut. What you are left with is a big flap going halfway around the jug. Don't try to bend the flap back to get into the jug or you'll end up struggling with it. Bend the flap down outside of the jug. If yours works the way mine does, it will stay in place or at least far enough out of the way to make it easy to do your ws. Now put your soil in and plant your seeds, etc.

This method gives you more room to work with than the traditional flap method (ha, that sounds funny to me) and at the same time gives you more stability than you'd get if you'd cut almost all of the way around the jug starting at one side of the handle and ending at the other side, making a hinge. Now if you want to use the hole punch and twist tie way of closing the flap as mentioned above you can do that. Doing it this way will be sturdy because you haven't cut around the jug as far as usual. I fasten the jug together at the vertical cut and I think it stays shut pretty well. Two or three holes on each side (1.flap, and 2. solid part of jug) should keep the flap in place. This method I described is easiest for a right-handed person. A left-handed person would basically do the same thing, making a flap that goes halfway around the jug but have the flap opening the other way (towards your right side instead of your left). Oh, a scissors works easiest for me.

Also, I didn't like the mess I got and the waiting I had to do when I watered the potting soil before I planted the seeds. So I plant first and then water. I don't water until the jug flap is secured into place. I take a quart-size (easy to lift) plastic watering can and aim the spout at the milk jug rim on the inside and keep turning it until it gets all the way around the jug and I think there's enough water in it. This way it's actually bottom watered instead of top watered; the seeds should stay in place and not go wandering around in little puddles of water.

I don't have photos, but I will try to get a few once I get around to starting to winter sow. We actually cut ours like Dee the first year..almost all around with a hinge, and we punched holes with a hole punch and used twist ties to hold it closed and it worked without any problems. I did find that by the time I was finished using them, the paper was all off of the twist ties and the metal had rusted, but they still worked, just harder to untwist. I did find it a pain to have to keep opening the twist tie when I wanted a good look inside or to vent or water.

The next year, we tried the flap method. Like mswngal...we did our flap in the opposite direction as terrene.
We made a fairly large flap that almost takes up all of one side. When filling with soil and sowing seeds, I use a clothespin to keep the flap in the up and open position. When they go out, it surprised me that the flaps seemed to naturally stay in the closed position. Often they will just snap into the lower edge. In effect they stay closed enough without any additional efforts, like tape or twist ties. I found this so much easier and more convenient. I didn't cut myself on the edge bc of the size of the flap and the clothespin while working with it. The containers are then easily lifted and moved. I am happy with this method. It is an improvement over the other way, as you preserve the structure of the container which makes for easy moving, you can quickly fip open all the flaps on a warm day rather than having to untwist all the ties, it is difficult to water all the containers if you are trying to get the water in the small opening at the top, so with the twist ties that means opening them all. With the flaps, it is just a flip up of the flap to water. Say that 10 times really fast..lol!

We used a kitchen shears to cut the containers and found it made the job easy. You know the kind that will cut through chicken bones? My husband drills all the holes w a portable drill. The only part of our preparation that is changed this year, is that I bought a new marker that is supposed to be sun resistant for my labels, because the Sharpie faded so fast last year, I had no labels by the time everything had sprouted.

If I can get my hands on enough plastic forks, I may use those inside the containers with labeling info on it. So I can then use the label when I plant out.

As far as getting the plants out of the containers, we just cut all the tops when it is warm enough not to need them anyway.

pm2

I label mine by using cut up miniblinds that were going to be thrown away. I use permanent marker and place it inside the container. They worked fine last year.

Pam

Lots of interesting ideas about how to cut the jugs...sounds like fun to experiment with a few different methods!

Using mini-blinds is such a good idea for markers. Next time I get the chance I'm going to snatch some slats from mini-blinds. The aluminum tape works okay but it's kind of labor intensive. Pam did your labels fade with the permanent marker?

I want some plant markers to stick in the ground with the seedlings, so I can remember what I planted. The labels have to hold up to the elements.

I use cut up yogurt cups, write with paint pen. I had good results with them last year.

Karen

see i was thinking about the thing of writing what you planted on the rocks (flatish) and i guess you laquer (sp) them and it holds up really good. umm diy or maybe frugal gardening and they saw it and tried it. but i'm thinking about doing that. and you can use some sort of paints, to prettify it!! or coolify it!! LOL

I used the hinge method with my first bunch. I just prepped some this evening using the upside down U method. I will see which ones I like better.

For markers, you can also cut the top and bottom off an aluminum pop can and then cut down the side to make a rectangular sheet. Then you can cut strips from that and "emboss" the name of your plant with the point of a nail. These will last for years. If you have trouble seeing the embossing, you can run across it with a crayon, a grease pencil or a little paint.

That is a nice idea too. I don't like to 'make' labels because it can be labor intensive, time intensive, but if I don't need too many and I don't have any, I have cut plastic 1 litre bottles into strips, cut a pointed end and then write on those. No cost, recycling and we usually have these bottles hanging around.

sorry prairiemoon i sent it too you, LOL but i was wondering what marker/pen you used, i know or think alot of us newbie's are very interested in cheaper ways of doing this and it actually working, so any help from any of you "seasoned" (LOL) ws'rs would really be helpful to us!! :'))

Last year, someone on the WS forum talked about using a different marker that did hold up outside. When I ordered seeds with Thompson and Morgan over the summer, I looked to see if they offered one and they did. It is called:

Perma Stake Garden Marker, for outdoor use. It is supposed to be water and fade resistant. I believe it is supposed to be UV resistant. I thought that was supposed to be the difference between this and a Sharpie. My first year trying it, so I will be sure to report back.

BTW, I am far from seasoned..lol. Only my third season winter sowing and I know there are others that have been here lots longer and do more winter sowing than I do!

:-)
pm2

way awesome!!
i have this one tomatoe plant that grows back in the same spot each year, and it never grows anything but it grows there. LOL but if that's seasoned, i'm seasoned. LOL i think you count. LOL :'))

I used china marker pencil on my tags (cut up blinds) in my containers last winter. I can still read the ones that went out into my garden last spring with the seedlings.
The markers are very 'waxy', and aren't fazed by sun or rain.

Wendey, I don't know how you do that! I thought it sounded like a great idea and last year I went out and bought a half dozen china markers. For some strange reason I just enjoy china markers. [g] I like peeling them. lol I tried writing directly on my milk jugs last year and I found it was bothering my hands because I had to press down too hard. So I have a lot of china markers now looking for something to do with them. [g]

Maybe it was your cut up blinds that were easier to write on then the milk jugs?

did ya just get them at walmart or.....? i might try one of them. and maybe one of the pm2 thingi's. LOL

i know over in another thread they were talking about kinds of seeds you could just put in the ground, i'm kinda anxiously looking that up, does anyone have any info on that by chance?? there's alot of mumbo jumbo on it, that i'm just not being able to breakdwn, LOL so do ya'll have experince in this area?? cuz i'm so running out of containers so i would so LOVE info in this area too!! LOL i know i was thinking on the foxgloves and columbines anyhow and clematises, well theres already some out there, LOL but do ya';ll have any more that would be good one's??

For me, the permanent marker on the miniblind strips did not fade while in the containers, but it did in the yard. I used a car touch up paint marker from the auto parts store. You can use the rolling tip or the thin paint brush tip. That worked and didn't fade, but my dogs keeps eating them. I heard someone say to use pieces from a broken clay pot or the rock idea. I don't think she would eat those. I've used plastic spoons, the metal miniblinds and the plastic and she will chew them all up.

Hope this helps. :-)

Pam

that's cool!! i will have to try that, i thought you could get them for like under a couple of bucks right? at walmart for sure!!

heck i didn't think, if could last with a car, LOL it should be able to in a garden!! :')) **BIG SMILE*** LOL

I do mine like dee I also punch or slice holes on the bottom for drainage and then I use a small hole punch from my craft supplies and then punch out eight holes on each piece and then use some florist wire to keep the two pieces together and the small punches I guess also help with the air flow since I don't cut any thing else out of the jug. And I have had great suscess doing it this way.

I just pull out the florsit wire until it is about the length of of my hand ffrom the fingertips to the wriost and then just keep it at that length and then fold it over and over and over well you get the picture and then use some kitchen shears and cut them apart and then there my ties are ready.

Paula

Thanks for posting this. Last year was my first year to WS. However, I only used the deep dish lasagna pans, not the milk jugs. I am wanting to do some of both this year, so I'm glad to have pictures/ideas.

Cloud9, so you only punched two holes total, across from the hinge? Was this a success for you and did it stay on securely? Sorry for all the questions ... it sounds like a really neat idea.

hey!! we want ALL the questions, so everyone can get answers!! some people are just too shy to ask!! i was, then i started thinking, hey i don't want all these seeds going to waste!! LOL so don't be afraid to ask, we may have never thought of the question either. LOL and that's a good question, i'm so using all my pans for the cups of plants that need water. LOL

Yes, only two holes works fine for me. Each hole is about 1/2" from the cut. When I twist tie them together, the upper and lower edges overlap this 1/2" and give a bit of stability. I usually fit the top into the bottom so any moisture running down the sides will be directed into the bottom, If you use plastic covered ties or wire rust-through will not be an issue. I have a spool of self-cutting twist ties that I bought in the garden section. I am constantly picking up my jugs to move them around or check for sprouts and have never had any issues with stability. Perhaps it is my overlap?

BTW - if you don't have any miniblinds to repurpose, a small one can be bought for only about $3 - $4. One blind makes approximately a bajillion markers. If you donÂt think you could use a bajillion in a lifetime a package of plastic knives from the dollar store works well also.

Deb

Deb, thanks for your detailed response. I can really picture it now. I think I'll give it a shot.

Medontdo, it's nice to have a forum where can all share ideas.

i am SOOO glad that i could help someone!! i've gotten alot of info out of this so far!! and tonight i've used yarn instead of the other to tie the jugs, only cuz yarn was all i had, i tied it like ya do your shoes, so it'd be easier to get undone later. but i was so busy that i forgot to go dee's way and ended up my way, and still did it with the hole punch, worked out ok, i'll just have to remember next time, half way!! LOL
sometimes i just get stuck in one way, LOL ps some 2nd hand stores sell them mini blinds for cheap too if your one of diligent (if thats the word) them shoppers. :'))

I'd make a request on freecycle for your area to get the mini blinds free first or place a wanted add on craigslist.com. If you lived near me I could give you a whole blind. If you have some on your windows at home just check to see if you can shorten them just a touch. Most people leave all the extras on the bottom. Just be careful not to cut the cords to short that you can't replace the bottom part. :-)

:-) Pam