13,520 Garden Web Discussions | Perennials
I start off with a few spring posies and winter-blooming honeysuckles or wintersweet, with great enthusiasm...but by the time the roses are blooming, the house has become filled with forgotten (ignored) pots and jamjars with flowers in various stages of decay....which end up as whiffy dust-gatherers.
I am looking at a pot of dessicated achilleas right this moment...but doing zilch to actually lever my fat arse off my chair and deal with it. Shameless slattern, that I am.
Yours are stunning ! The ones I grew this year, didn't look anything like what was shown on the packages I had purchased, or haven't bloomed at all...I sure do miss 'Yachiyo Tsubaki' & ' Alfred Grille' which grew quite well , flowered beautifully and returned for several years.
Is that last one Alfred, or 'Stars Favorite'?
I'm not familiar with these two cultivars, though was disappointed in the short flowering season of Stokes Aster, way back in the early 90's .
Then, I happened to come across some seeds of 'Klaus Jeltto' & not a single seedling grew...I don't know exactly what is going on in plant genetics these days, but maybe I'm out of touch ( though maybe not, totally) of what goes on with plant breeding these days. Could it perhaps be some are possibly F1 hybrids & may be nearly or entirely sterile?
My other thoughts, being inbreeding, to obtain the desired plant flower characteristics & then using newer propagation techniques? With inbreeding, having the effect of possibly greatly reducing, or nearly completely preventing any seed production.
In some cases, I suspect it may well keep you 'stuck' with buying the named variety, (or else, if by seeds), only available by the original hybridizer source. All the while, giving the possibly false appearance of being easily grown when available by numerous suppliers or other sources.
The other, is of course as you suggested; they appear nearly the same... They just may be the exact same plants & it was just a case of being easier to simply use different labels they had on hand, used for the exact same plants.
I did a little research & noticed under the plant patent info, that under the description of "Seeds and fruit; not observed." I think this info was for 'Mel's Blue' . The comparison was made to that of 'Purple Parasols', of which it seems to have appeared from. So, maybe it was a single seedling, which happened to grow by chance.
You'd probably have to grow some regular Stokesia laevis from purchased seeds & then cross pollinate, (so as to outcross) as inbreeding causes depression in fertility.
This situation reminds me of growing patented Scabiosa caucasica, 'Ultra Violet' in the past (as I enjoy blue flowers also) & it did not set seeds, either. It was a chance seedlings, that appeared out of 'Deep Waters'. Now, I've grown & flowered 'Fama Deep Blue' from seeds, yet get no seeds! Now, I'm buying 'Deep Waters' seeds, to try & make my own seeds, so I don't have to buy the other.
IOW. I'm starting to wonder, if it isn't just a way to get you to buy patented plants (or seeds) of perennials- each year!
Although I don't think it is the exact same plants being sold under different names. Like I found out about , in the instance of the fairly recently introduced Chocolate Cosmos ; 'Chocamocha/Thomocha". One & the same, under two names, as near as I can tell.
My only other 'mum is "Matchstick". I have moved it 3 times in 4 years and in this location I am now starting to see the potential.
I trimmed it back multiple times this season with the most recent time in mid August and still it has given me some flowers.
Ohh, I like that "Matchstick". Think I will have to order it online as have not seen that one at my local nurseries.
"Twilight Pink" is still my favorite (originally bought under the My Favorite logo) Mammoth. I have found that it responds to taking snippets off with new growth much quicker than My Favorite Autumn Red.
Picked up a "Yellow Quill" last week and hope it survives in its new location. Previously YQ has gotten smaller and smaller each year until it disappeared.
Throughout the summer I would curse the deer seeing the young triloba often getting snacked on, thinking we wouldnt see those wonderful late summer blooms.
But there was a sliver lining...these same plants are in full bloom now and very much shorter (between 18" and 24")...a little bit different
I'm leaning towards using the area as a native flower/pollinator garden in the summer and a spring bulb garden in the spring, if that makes sense.
In theory bee balm should be perfect for the area but it doesn't look healthy. Daffs don't seem to spread much in this area. The nodding onion and echinacea seem to be doing best.
Is it too early to divide an aster or echinacea planted last fall? When would I do it? Gardengal48, if I want reseeding what variety would be good to buy to reseed/interbreed with the regular purple echinacea? If it doesn't grow true to form, does the "natural" form still look good? I have purple echinacea I planted last year and a small struggling orange one I purchased late this year.
Rudbeckia goldstrum is a good thought. I tried to plant some before, but they didn't take. I'll have to try that again. One problem I have is that I planted repeating, regular rows of several types of plants, but only a couple of each type of plant "took", so it looks rather messy and irregular.
This post was edited by edlincoln on Wed, Oct 1, 14 at 14:58
Dividing late blooming perennials - the asters and echinacea - is usually recommended for spring. And I've included a link that has an excellent discussion on propagating echinacea. The species forms (like Echinacea purpurea) would likely make the best seed source as the modern hybrids - those with the bright, flashy colors, like red, yellow and orange - are often sterile. And you can choose any of the popular varieties of purple cone flowers to mix and match. Or you can try some E. paradoxa and develop your own hybrids.
Here is a link that might be useful: all about echinaceas - scroll down to propagation
Need cool and bright conditions for mums. Garden varieties in bloom outdoors now will bloom until their season is over and not continue on through the winter, regardless of the growing conditions provided. Some kinds might be induced to throw additional flushes on new growth made in a suitable greenhouse environment (not an ordinary household interior) but will probably not be likely to produce another full display until the their main season comes around again.
go ahead and do it ... and when they get infested with bugs.. and fail due to lack of light .. etc .. just get rid of them ...
i doubt you will succeed ... but you dont tell us where you are.. or what you mean by indoors ... etc ...
but you dont need others permission to do what you want ...
i dont know why you didnt start a new post ... as my suggestions are clearly covered in the 6 year old post ...
ken
The series of roses hybridized by Griffith Buck at Iowa State are worth looking into. In addition to good winter hardiness, some are markedly fragrant.
Rugosas have been rock-hardy for me.
By the way, unless you live in the far northeast or northwest corner of Iowa, you're now in zone 5, so roses should automatically be a bit hardier. :)
This post was edited by eric_oh on Wed, Oct 1, 14 at 8:26
Garden Harvest Supply--They ship live plants and have a really big selection of Mums. I've had extremely good luck with them. Their plants come in larger pots and have well-established root systems. They also have wholesale-priced trays. :)
Here is a link that might be useful: GHS-place for mums
Green_go- yes, I love those! I think they will look great with the little lime. I think I will have to wait until next spring to find them though.
laceyvail- I am rethinking (maybe a little buyers remorse?) the clethra. I already bought 3 of each so I need to find a place for them somewhere...but I am becoming concerned about the overall space they might need width wise in my bed. I don't want to crowd out the Viburnum Winterthul I am spotlighting in a large corner of the bed (7 x 7 area). So I will probably move the clethra out of that bed altogether (nothing is planted yet I am just playing with them in their pots right now).Thanks for your insights on the growing conditions!
If the plants are showing new growth at the base going into winter and you add a couple inches of mulch, they have a decent shot of overwintering.
Most times, mums are pushed into maximal bloom for late summer/fall sales, apparently are exhausted by the end of the season and doubtful winter survivors.
I would treat all late-planted mums as annuals and take even minimal overwintering as a plus.
By the way, it's probably not a good idea to place new plantings in a pure soil amendment product if the surrounding soil isn't good (i.e. dense and clayey). The planting spot will wind up being a moisture sink and the roots will likely stay in that spot without spreading out into surrounding soil, thus limiting hardiness.
I was told in another thread that mulching the base of roses can cause stem canker.
These mums were bought at a nursery and not a big box store, but they seem pretty standard to me.
I didn't know that about soil amendment... I just thought I was giving them the best possible soil to grow in. Well, I guess we'll find out in the spring if they make it! :)
Campanula, try slashing and then letting it rot on the ground. It is messy for a few years but it is great for the soil and wildlife. I slash and leave it. It stops the run off. I leave it in berms and some all over. One rancher says he will go back in 5 years and burn what is left. We have a lot of grade change in our land and torrential rains and dirt that flows easily ( caliche). So leaving branches and leafy twigs is important to catch the dirt. They are much better at catching the wind driven leaves in the fall. I was back in the gorge and saw snakes chasing frogs through the twiggy berms that I left. where the berms are is where I have trees sprouting. AND there was 4 inches of dirt behind the berms.. I use the slash to protect the seedlings from the deer.
Today I was burning stuff that was close to the buildings that are by the more "formal (misnomer) garden". My husband does not like the mess that I leave for the retention berms. He likes things looking very 'park like". So around the buildings , we do it his way.
Yep I will be pretty smoky smelling all week. I did get a massage from a traveling masseuse too so I was a pile of jello at the end of the day.
Grief - keeping my finger's crossed for you, Ryse. Next year (and all succeeding years) you will look back in amazement (and pride) that you survived to grow a new garden and make a new home your own. Hugs.
I hate winter moves.
Have you used online house search sites like Trulia? They were really helpful for us, to look at places near and far, for free! We spent hours pouring over what we saw on the internet, then went to see in person the best ones. It really helped us. It was an emotional help, too - we were able to feel like we were doing something as we stayed up late from sleeplessness. Moving is so stressful!!! But once you get your new house, it turns into an adventure!!! Good luck!!!