22,795 Garden Web Discussions | Roses
Alright, just moved the seedling to the pot, and found it was two seedlings! Separated and took a closer look at them. One of them has a habit familiar with Dr. Huey, but no mildew at all, so I"m rather confused. The other is just one long stem/root filled with buds, so here's hoping I didn't do much damage. Pruned both a bit to help ease the transplant shock. Will keep you folks updated.
Also, they need a range of heights on hmf because the same rose can grow to vastly different heights in different zones and different conditions. A lot of the hybrid teas I put in recently are listed as heights 2.5-6', which is one heckova range. The reason is that in California, or other warm climates, HTs continue to put on growth all year and don't die back, whereas we in colder zones have them usually die to the ground in the winter and get much lower heights. I tend to plan within a foot of the lower height range for any rose not well suited to my climate. In Dallas, I might do the reverse on the upper end of the height range.
Also, if you want DD or any other rose to grow more, something to try is to pinch off the blooms for most of the season and force more root growth. In particular, this can be handy for new roses that haven't come into their full 3-year growth yet. You don't have to do this as much as we do in cold zones to help with winter survival, but it's one way to see if you can encourage growth. Mind you, some roses are indeed runts and not likely to grow beyond where they've decided to stop based on your conditions, regardless of treatment or what they're "supposed" to do. Even in my climate, Abraham Darby is supposed to be 6' or more, but mine is 5 years old and barely clears knee height at the best of times. No amount of tough love or coddling is going to change his mind I fear, and he clearly has refused to read his own information on the color tag still attached to his label. Stubborn, but toughness is a virtue in my yard.
Cynthia
DD is a heavy feeder and she also loves iron so if there is any signs of chlorosis, adding iron chelate will improve its vigor. Like Cynthia said, pinching buds off do help the plant to produce basal shoots, even in my hot climate. I pinch off any buds that don't look perfect so that I have lots of perfect blooms for cutting.
Sympathies Nick, and I do agree with Sharon that it's worth another try. I've now lost two Love Song plants, but both were deeply cankered each year (different companies) and the canes weakened with time. Now that it's available own root, I'll go that direction and expect better results. Hang in there - gardening is about persistence and patience as well!
Cynthia
For what it's worth, here's a bloom from my new JFK from Lowe's, for comparison whenever yours blooms. There's the vaguest hint of cream at the center in the bud stage, but this disappears to the snow white blooms Seil mentions. Yours sounds lovely even if mislabeled.
Cynthia
From what you know about these roses, you seem to have the front row vs. back row as good as you can know, though Dark Desire is too new to know exactly how big it'll turn out to be in different zones. I'm planning on mine being relatively shorter. Chrysler Imperial and Christian Dior and the first unnamed monster sound fine in the back row. The foreground row definitely are smaller roses in my climate, but it depends on where you are how big they'll get for you. The only comment is that the taller roses in general tend to need more space than the shorter ones. I think the 3' in the back should be fine for the ones you can identify, since they tend to be relatively upright bushes. The 5' spacing in the front is probably more than you need for those smaller roses, but hey- you have to keep some space open for next year's roses! You might put some annuals in between the roses to fill in the space - I use things like the Salvia Victoria Blue since the purple color ties everything together, it blooms all season, and I yank it all out after the winter kills it. There are ample choices out there to fill in the visual space while you see what these roses do in YOUR yard.
Cynthia
Thanks SO much everyone. I posted this and then promptly went out of town, so I'm sorry for the delay getting back over here. What great advice.
Searching locally is a great idea. There is a rose garden in downtown Raleigh that I used to walk through when I was in college. Beautiful place and you all have reminded me to go again to see if there are identifying tags for the roses!
We are building in New Hill NC, which is about 30 minutes southwest of Raleigh down US 1. Looks like Roses Unlimited is about 4 hours away (have to get through Charlotte), so it could be a nice day trip without the kids!
You all have given me a great starting point and just the type of direction I was hoping for.
Thanks again. I'll check back in with my progress in a couple of months! :)
That will probably take care of it. You may still see some leaves spotting at first. Those are leaves that were already infected but not showing symptoms yet. Those will still spot and fall off but you've protected any more leaves from being infected. Follow all the directions carefully and spray again, when it says, to prevent it from coming back.
The product shown is neem oil with the azadirachtin removed. It will burn leaves in hot weather, as will baking soda--or even in moderate weather if the plants were not well hydrated before spraying. The large purple smears could be spray damage. Neither of these products gives very good control of spot diseases.
The bad foliage has several problems, not altogether clear what. As suggested above, the definite white spots are where rose slugs have peeled off the undersurface, leaving a translucent window. You have a very mild case so far. Just wipe the worms off the underside, or ignore it. I don't know what to make of the fine white speckling and abraded look in images 2 and 3. I suspect rose mosaic virus, which is incurable but not usually a crippling problem.
While some of the spots could be downy mildew symptoms, you can be sure that leaves with active DM will drop off the stems within a week or so. If spotted leaves do not drop, it isn't DM. Also DM usually attacks the newest foliage first.
I don't see any spots that look like blackspot (fringy or notched). Anyway, KO is virtually immune. However, KO commonly gets cercospora spot disease in my area. Some of the spots are probably that. It won't likely be a significant problem.
Finally, brown discs lining the leaf margin are a reliable sign of fertilizer burn.
Your rose may be suffering from too much TLC.
As buford said, "organic" doesn't mean non-toxic. Since all things are made up of chemicals even organic solutions are chemicals. You still need to be careful and use proper precautions to use them.
I have used Green Cure and Serenade with varying degrees of success. The sooner you catch it and use them the better. Maybe preemptive spraying would be even better. In either case use the formula for "cure" and not the prevention one, which is weaker. I have tried that one and it didn't seem to do much at all.
Also, an observational warning, right after you spray don't be surprised if it seems like it got worse. The spray does not cure already infected leaves and what you are seeing are leaves that had already been infected, but were not showing symptoms yet, showing the spots. The spray will only prevent leaves that are not already infected from getting it.
When I first started with roses, I remember getting quite upset about any disease or bug issues, concerned that my new roses would die. After a few years, I saw a pattern develop here in rainy Oregon. After the roses leaf out , it is still raining quite a bit and bs runs rampant. If the bs reaches the top leaves of a plant -- that rose does not have sufficient disease resistancy for my garden. I don't generally spray, but "proof" roses to determine which are most disease resistant. Once it gets the end of June, warmer, drier weather arrives and the only thing I do is pick off the bottom leaves with bs. Rust is another matter. If a rose is prone to that, it's gone. Haven't sprayed for years -- determining which roses are more disease resistant and enduring a month of bs is all that I do.
It also depends on how hot it is. For example, we are heading into winter now in Australia so blooms like Jude the Obscure will last 3 days. In summer it will blow in one day! Thank goodness it is always in flower.
Jude the Obscure
On the opposite end Yves Piaget have flowers that open so slowly on the bush it takes a week for a bud to open to that high centered HT shape, and then the flower lasts well for another week or two.
Yves Piaget
Graham Thomas should get between 5-6 hours of sun there. Watering him should't be a problem but thanks for letting me know. My baby Abraham Darby (or Darling as my son calls it) throws a fit if I go more than a couple of days without watering him. Hopefully when the roots are better developed he'll toughen up a bit.
Yes, all four spots should have plenty of room for them to grow.
No. That's what I meant about not having a memory card. Drove all the way and when I got there, got my camera out and started to shoot -- no memory card. Had to make the best of it and take notes. We even went to their store in the hopes that they would have memory cards. No go. You can sure bet that next time I will make sure I have a couple.
What a shame! Sounds like it was a sight to behold. I'll look forward to all the great pics next year ;-)