22,795 Garden Web Discussions | Roses
The reason I'm able to cut my floribundas to the ground before spring is that there is never live healthy cane at winters end. Even those which do not appear dead have discolored centers when trimmed if I allow them to grow they will not have healthy leaves. They go down to the crown every year. The unhealthy canes don't provide food to the rose. So they are safe to remove in the middle of our ice cold winters. In spring feeder roots that have died will begin to grow. Canes will sprout again. Healthy leaves will feed the roots. The beautiful roses will be back.
I've never had any luck with "tender" (many floribundas, most hybrid teas, some shrubs, etc.) roses in the ground; whether against a south wall exposed, or mounded after freezing weather with free-draining mulch, they always die back to the crown. Come spring, it's always prune down to those last few inches!
My 'Papa Meilland' was a fantastic example of this, but came back very well each season I had it and was always around four feet tall by the end of July.
Interestingly to me, nickjoseph, is what a different type of Zone 5 climate you experience there in Wisconsin.
Here in my south-central Michigan (southern most county very near Interstate 69) I had NO blackspot on my two roses I would suspect to have it the most ('Angel Face' and 'Mirandy'), and I have NEVER seen rust in my location (nor 15 miles southeast at my father's). Generally blackspot is the most prevalent fungal presence in my humid climate.
This year's scourge for me was powdery mildew. 'Therese Bugnet' seemed to be heavily infected this season, beginning shortly after the new season's growth began (but after my main spring flush) and 'Mirandy' started showing signs and touches of it through September only.
I did not spray this year except for washing down of plants with copious fresh water spray.
My AF and Mirandy are my first-time pot experiments, and I love trying new things.
I suppose the best option, of course, is to select those wonderful, cane hardy varieties for us here in the Great North.
I have found Rugosas and gallicas to be exceptionally impressive in this regard, and look forward to trying more classes of these roses.
Interestingly, Westerland, which I often seen rated as hardy, always died near the ground for me in a southern, sheltered site. I ended up SP'ing this one.
The once-bloomers are more than worth their place (especially if one has the room) in the garden during their one, extended, intense, and bountiful display of blousy beauty.
Steven
I am also thinking of having a sprinkler system with drip in the beds for my front yard. how does that work, zone wise. Are the drips different zones than the sprinklers for the lawns? If I have the sprinkler system installed by professionals, could I do the drip on my own (to save money) or is that not advised? I do have a rather large (wide) front yard with beds all over the place so I would probably need a few different zones. And obviously I don't want the sprinklers to spray on my roses.
buford,
One 1/4 inch hose can handle about 10 drippers without a loss in volume. So, you could run a 1/4" hose out to a bed and using Tee's water 10 roses. At the water source you would attach a timer, back-flow preventor, a pressure reducer, and a piece of 1/2 inch hose. The end of that hose is either capped or bent backwards to close it off. They sell units just for that, looks like a figure-8.
Along that 1/2" hose you insert plugs that the 1/4 inch hoses are attached to. They can be just inches apart.
Don't bury the 1/4 inch hose, just pin it down on top of the grass. In a few weeks you won't see it so run straight lines to the beds. At the end of each 1/4" hose attach a dripper of the correct volume (ie. 1/2 gal, 1 gal, etc)
hope that helps.....
Bellarosa - whether Red Cascade climbs or sprawls depends on how you grow her. If you tie her up to a support, she climbs. If not, she covers ground. What makes it work as a ground cover is that it doesn't just bloom at the end like most climbers (which would make them poor as ground covers). Instead, it puts out a lot of short laterals at regular intervals, so blooms pop up all over the place. As I recall, mine had about 4 or 5 main canes, each of which spread in a different direction with scattered blooms along the length.
I agree - hmf is the best website for roses! Everyone should support it if possible with a premium membership so it stays around!
Cynthia
Cynthia, I looked into the two Fairy Tale roses you mentioned and OMG! They are absolutely beautiful. Thank you so much for suggesting them.
Iris_gal I totally agree with you on Molineux. It's color is a hard yellow. Not a bad rose or color at all, but I wouldn't add it to a bed of pastels.
It's funny, like you I have picked up a perennial or shrub before and marched around a nursery holding it against other plants I consider as possible combinations. One time a fellow gardener and I got kinda carried away and had a whole perennial grouping worked out with gallon size potted plants before we realized we had an audience of the amused nursery owner and several other customers. The owner told me later that she sold two complete sets of our little layout exercise...lol So yes, she didn't mind at all!
Meredith, thank you for suggesting Anne Hathaway and Sans Souci... I want them both!!! Sans Souci for its incredible color and shape, not to mention the name. Anne Hathaway has a great "presence" from the pics I saw online... I am not sure how healthy she will be though. Much as I like Harkness roses, they tend to not be the healthiest or hardiest roses in my corner of the country. It would be great if she were an exception. Maybe being planted close to the house would help in the hardiness department. Sigh... so many great choices... I fear for the evergreen yew shrubs further down the line of my foundation planting...at this rate I will have the foundation beds all along my house filled before we hit Christmas...lol
You are all so wonderful generously recommending roses that could fit my dream bed... how cool is that?!
Hi Marc
Glad you have more rose ideas than you can use - now you need to make more rose beds to put them in (smile)! You've gotten some great suggestions as well from other folks, and I thought I'd add my two cents about height or hardiness in my zone.
Ambridge Rose is rock solid hardy and a nice bloomer, but gets at least 4-5' for me, and that's true in two different spots in my yard
Sans Souci sounds like it would be worth a try - I don't have that one but I have plenty of Barni roses in my yard that come through the winters fine. You might want to look at Antico Amore, that a friend in Omaha swears by (it's a nice medium pink, and not too tall). Anna Fendi is a nice apricot that fades to cream, and Stile 800 is an apricot that mostly stays apricot and it's in the 3-4' range (of the two, I prefer the latter)
Paul Bocuse is lovely and an intriguing mix of apricot and yellow, but I think it'll get too tall. It's a survivor in my zone 4 pocket in front of my house, but tends to be at least 5' even after being trimmed to the ground last spring
Of course we want pictures when you're done!
Cynthia
In my zone 5, Cecile Brunner can grow reasonably well, but it depends on which version of Cecile Brunner, cl. you are talking about. There are several bush forms that pop up on the sales lists, and at least two climbing forms that I have. Cecile Brunner cl. that's the Hosp polyantha climber is pretty reliable at surviving most winters for me, though it bit the dust in the polar vortex and was replaced last year. It doesn't bloom as often as I would wish, but it's a healthy and hardy rose. Cecile Brunner Everblooming cl., the Siskiyou climber I got from Heirloom, is new this spring and I think I planted and lost it several years ago. This one seems to be a little less hardy for me, but I didn't have it in a particularly protected area, as it's next to the rest of my hybrid musks.
In response to bboy's comments, I think hybrid musks are much more hardy than they are typically rated. Most of them are rated zone 6, but I have around 10 of them happily on their 4th or 5th year in a relatively exposed area of my yard. A few seems to live down to their z6 rating - Moonlight and Renae come to mind for me - but most of them are bullet proof and generally tip hardy for me.
The bottom line is that both Cecile Brunner cl. are rated to z5, but you won't know if it likes your conditions until you try it. If your zone is indeed stretching into z4, that can make a big difference for many climbers, so it might be safer to try it in a protected spot. A way that I create a "protected spot" where there isn't one already is to stand leaf bags around the wimpy rose once the temperatures are around a high of 20's. I've already done that for my teas this year, and they're going on 5 or 6 years in my yard and none of them are rated any lower than zone 7. They've been pretty happy, even tip hardy under these circumstances, and are among my more reliable bloomers in heat.
Cynthia
Depending on how cold it got during this time, 4 or 5 years isn't a very long trial. Hardiness zones are frequently misapplied, somebody could easily list a rose as Zone 6 because it freezes at 0F or Zone 7 because it freezes at 10F. And I have found that when I do a literature review of a particular rose there can be a multiple zone variation in hardiness assignments. So apparently hardiness ratings are given rather often that are just plain wrong. I have noticed for years roses I am interested in and have personal exposure to being given highly optimistic zone designations. Statements in commercial literature in particular should always be considered subject to verification.
lilfinch, Yes she is own root. All of my roses are own root. Got her when they were called Flower Circus roses so she's been hear a long time. Own root seems to be the only roses that have grown well here. I've had dr. huey multiflora and a third one can't recall the name. When shovel pruning they all had roots not much larger than when they were planted. Pomponella could not be found own root back then. She put down her own roots a long time ago and abandoned the multiflora. Had to move one and the graft was just laying there unused. For me least own root gives me good strong roses that seems to better handle what mother nature can dish out. Years with to much rain, no rain, frigid weather and so on. Sorry for being long winded.
This post was edited by pattyw5 on Fri, Nov 14, 14 at 10:25
Healthy and fragrant there's Polar Express. It's creamy white fading to white. Can't wait to get the new Ice Cap Rose. It's from Radler in conjunction with Meilland Int. Unfortunately my guess is it's going to be scentless as it sounds like a double flowered White Out. While WO is totally disease free here In high humidity in the corn belt. Don't know how she does in the gulf coast states.Just a couple more beauties to consider. As they grow like Margaret Merrill did for me.She had horrible black spot here if not sprayed.
I'm sorry that I neglected to tell you about Margaret Merrill. When I sprayed She was glorious to my eye. Bringing to mind pure sweet innocents. One of the hardest shovel prunes ever. I'm scent challenged and don't remember her being smelly. She formed nice round even growth. Knee high I think. Don't recall continuous bloom but bloomed in flushes. Someone correct me if I'm wrong please.
This post was edited by pattyw5 on Sat, Nov 15, 14 at 16:55
If one of the wild roses has an immunity against the virus, it may be possible that grafting ornamental roses to that wild rose (used as understock) may transfer the immunity.
"if silenced rootstock can efficiently transmit the silencing signal to non-transformed scions, as has already been demonstrated in herbaceous plants."
This article is talking about adding genetically modified RNAi-eliciting constructs to normal rootstocks, but it should also work if a wild rose already has the proper RNAi.
See the review below.
Here is a link that might be useful: link to scientific article
People, including myself, love roses and roses will continue to be an important element in the garden. A way forward for the people, for the general public and science to work together to find a more effective control options for this disease growing problem. "
Here is a link that might be useful: http://alldiseasessheets.org/
Looked up Zaide at Newflora this morning as I was also considering this rose. Unfortunately it is not very disease resistant. I don't spray. Newflora gives Information on most of the Kordes roses sold in the US. Balinda's Dream mildewed badly for me. I'm still searching also.
This post was edited by pattyw5 on Thu, Nov 13, 14 at 11:59
There are few roses, in my opinion, that can compete with Gertrude Jekyll for fragrance, and also for vigorous growth. We grow this rose in an environment that gets quite a few hot days, and it just keeps on going. Since we live in semi-desert, we don't see any disease issues. Our GJ is own root, and does not seem to lose any growth through the winter. The thorns are quite signficant: you should wear good protection when pruning. GJ will easily spread out into a large bush with many canes coming from below ground. The fragrance is noticable 40 feets away when it is in bloom, which is most of the growing season for us. In order to avoid pruning parts of the top growth, I am now just taking whole canes off at ground level, and letting new ones replace them.
Renais
I am in the Nevada desert. Galloping Gertie does well, but does not bloom much, except for a spring and fall flush. It does smell great. I have Barone Prevost too, and it smells about the same. But my Barone Prvost balls for some reason in the spring. I have Belinda`s dream too, and for some reason, it has never had much fragrance. It is about 5 years old.
Since several have brought up the subject of Ebola Virus, the following may be of interest.
Around 1990 scientists started realizing that plants utilized the production of RNAi (RNA interference) to fight plant viruses.
"The discovery of RNAi was preceded first by observations of transcriptional inhibition by antisense RNA expressed in transgenic plants,[145] and more directly by reports of unexpected outcomes in experiments performed by plant scientists in the United States and the Netherlands in the early 1990s.[146] In an attempt to alter flower colors in petunias, researchers introduced additional copies of a gene encoding chalcone synthase, a key enzyme for flower pigmentation into petunia plants of normally pink or violet flower color. The overexpressed gene was expected to result in darker flowers, but instead produced less pigmented, fully or partially white flowers, indicating that the activity of chalcone synthase had been substantially decreased; in fact, both the endogenous genes and the transgenes were downregulated in the white flowers. Soon after, a related event termed quelling was noted in the fungus Neurospora crassa,[147] although it was not immediately recognized as related. Further investigation of the phenomenon in plants indicated that the downregulation was due to post-transcriptional inhibition of gene expression via an increased rate of mRNA degradation.[148] This phenomenon was called co-suppression of gene expression, but the molecular mechanism remained unknown.[149]
Not long after, plant virologists working on improving plant resistance to viral diseases observed a similar unexpected phenomenon. While it was known that plants expressing virus-specific proteins showed enhanced tolerance or resistance to viral infection, it was not expected that plants carrying only short, non-coding regions of viral RNA sequences would show similar levels of protection. Researchers believed that viral RNA produced by transgenes could also inhibit viral replication.[150] The reverse experiment, in which short sequences of plant genes were introduced into viruses, showed that the targeted gene was suppressed in an infected plant. This phenomenon was labeled "virus-induced gene silencing" (VIGS), and the set of such phenomena were collectively called post transcriptional gene silencing.[151]"
The above quote is from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNA_interference
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It did not take long to recognize that the same mechanism(s) take place in other virus infected forms of life.
Here is a very recent paper concerning RNAi and Ebola (plus other human infecting virus).
Title: "Postexposure Protection of Guinea Pigs against a Lethal Ebola Virus Challenge Is Conferred by RNA Interference"
"RNA interference (RNAi) represents a powerful, naturally occurring biological strategy for inhibiting gene expression. RNAi has been used in cell-culture systems to inhibit the replication of a number of viruses that cause disease in humans, including HIV, hepatitis B virus (HBV), hepatitis C virus, influenza virus, herpesviruses, poliovirus, human papillomavirus, respiratory syncytial virus, and coxsackievirus (reviewed in [4, 5]); more recently, it has been used to inhibit some emerging and reemerging viruses, including Marburg virus [6], lymphocytic choriomeningitis virus [7], and severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus [8]. "
http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/193/12/1650.full
Here is a link that might be useful: RNA interference (RNAi) and Ebola Virus
Ratdogheads, love your varieties of roses and the display. Thanks also for the names.
seil, seeing your lovely bouquet is bittersweet because I know this is the end of the rose season for you, and I'd like it to last longer. Still, they gave you a splendid send-off.
ratdogheads, that's a gorgeous display and I love how you've staged the roses in term of color grouping and choice of vases. The only one I have is Marie Pavie which looks so sweet in its little vase. Mine is white and I love the pink color of yours.
Ingrid