22,151 Garden Web Discussions | Roses
Great! Thank you, everyone. That's all good to know, and a big relief. OOPs on the date - I didn't realize the year was off. That'll get fixed like now.
*All* my roses consist of 4. I'm nowhere near where any of you are, just starting with not a lot of room in the sun. But yes, they get watched plenty as will this one. I'm really curious as to what it might turn out to be. If multiflora, as long as it's healthy and I can find a place for it, COOL!
Lynn T
Thanks for the help problem solving guys! I did have to chuckle a bit at your California gauge of how tall roses should be by this time of year, Kim, given the assumption of different height and air patterns with the columbine. Sadly, after this brutal winter nothing but the climbers are blooming at anything above knee height after being pruned to the ground, which puts them at exactly the same height (and presumably same air patterns) as the columbine pods.
I tend to like the theory of the plant-specific type of aphids going on here, particularly since it's so all or none on the plants. These are definitely the actively crawling (green colored) aphids, not just the honeydew residue, though I'm sure stickiness has something to do with them staying put for now.
WHICH of course raises another question in my ongoing puzzled brain - are there aphid-species-specific predators then? Are the peach aphids tastier than these "columbine aphids"? If not, then what's up with my usual ladybugs and other good guys? The columbine infestation is heavier than I usually notice for the first flush of roses, and this level of aphid swarm would definitely get my attention if it was on my roses. Presumably the predator level has to rise to the level of the food to be consumed, but it's definitely a greater imbalance this year than I've ever seen. As I've mentioned, I've seen fewer ladybugs this spring than usual, though plenty of other assorted bugs, and I was wondering if the harsh winter cut the usual spring population back. Usually they're crawling out of the mulch as soon as I pull it back from the roses, and invading the house all spring, but this year I saw none in the mulch and only one in the house. I'm sure they have some dormant eggs that will hatch eventually, but the inquiring side of my brain that is no longer consumed with rose planting is pondering the other half of this equation.
It's interesting to know that the peach aphid is the culprit for roses, Michael. OK, one more curious question on that account - I recently planted a peach tree in my yard, which is a good 4 years from blooming and even further from setting fruit. Still, once it does bloom, would you guess that having the roses to attract the peach aphid hurts the peach prospects or helps because it also attracts the predators? Being mostly organic (aka lazy), I'm unlikely to do anything about it unless it gets particularly bad, just curious.
Cynthia
Predators usually lag behind pests. We'll have a particularly wet winter and the following spring the pests are legion. They respond seemingly immediately to the increase in resources (food). The predators lag behind a season or two, but eventually catch up. I'd bet your lady bugs were either harder hit by the conditions or are slower to respond to the improving conditions, as if to naturally make sure there is ample food supply before they do their things. Of course not "consciously" but by development. Kim
I interpreted the article as stating that they first observed that potassium rich soil resulted in a lower incidence of virus symptoms :
"We observed that the incidence of SMV can be significantly reduced by application of K+.fertilizer."
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Then they did a controlled comparison involving the same type of soybean in potassium rich and potassium deficient soils:
"To investigate whether K+ supply affected the resistance of soybean plants to SMV, the susceptible soybean cultivar Williams 82 was planted in pots containing low-K+ soil with or without the addition of K+ fertilizer."
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They then went on to describe their research on genetically modified plants.
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Please note that in their literature review, they stated the following: "In seventeen case studies on viral disease, high K+ status reduced the incidence of viral diseases in nine studies, although five studies showed the opposite effect [22]."
This is why I wrote the title as a question.
Thanks Buford. If I go grafted (and it looks like I might have no other choice) then I'll get the plants from two different sources and cross my fingers. BTW, I'm fully aware Daconil fries the foliage on Double Delight. Right now I'm using Bayer (Tebuconazole) and previously Mancozeb.
Patrick, the disease pressures are different where you are from Nebraska, but I've been able to grow own-root Double Delight here in zone 5 reasonably well. In fact, my first DD was grafted from a local nursery and it was a wimp - never more than 6" tall and maybe bloomed once in 6 years. My plant from Roses Unlimited survived last year's brutal winter and is already taller than my grafted plant ever was. No telling how well it will bloom, since I pinch off blooms for the whole first year, but initial signs are promising.
You should note however that I seem to have notably poorer responses of grafted plants in my yard to others reporting on GW. Even the grafted plants that survive quickly go own-root if they last out more than a winter or two, so it doesn't resolve the question of whether grafted would be better for you. All I can say is that it can be done in zone 5, and I've not seen any sign of virus so far on this plant (doesn't mean it's not there, of course).
Cynthia
Yes indeed - I practically wet my knickers on coming across a citrus borer in my woods. We already have the large saperda poplar borer (have weekly frass inspections) and had to report it to Defra immediately.
Global food networks and cheap air travel - we are reeling from chalara decimating our ash trees (Dutch Elm all over again) - no cure.
Will be going a little crazy with the chainsaws..........
Once we started going to the University Library and reading plant pathology papers (and getting distracted by other articles in those journals), we started wondering what food supplies were going to be available in a couple of hundred years, if not in a couple of decades.
Then we drove out to Missouri and the monocultural agriculture out there started scaring us big time.
(Anybody ever wonder if the rubber ducks used in the 'races' that are used as money raisers are sterilized of zebra mussel larvae as they are moved between rivers?)
If there is an ant nest under the rose, it could create excessively fast drainage. This is not usually harmful and the rose roots will work around it, but it could have an effect on a new plant.
If you give 2 gallons twice a week, that should be more than adequate under normal conditions. Frequent sprinkling is not a good approach.
I never heard the term "bud blast" before for the disorder pictured in the link. Rose gardeners usually call it "balling" and attribute it to rain. As the article says, it is a botrytis fungal infection that spreads in cool weather with rain or fog. However, it does not cause wilted necks and blackened buds as described by the OP.
In the case of rose curculio, I would expect to find buds opening with many small holes in the petals, These are caused by the bug's needle-like proboscis piercing the bud while it is tightly furled. This pest is common in parts of California and occasional in my area. It can cause wilted necks as Lyn's link shows.
This post was edited by michaelg on Wed, Jun 11, 14 at 9:35
I order from ARE and Chamblees. I have not ordered from CHamblees for a few years since I have found what I want at ARE.
I am glad your Reines de Violettes is doing well. Mine is struggling, yet many of my roses are not thriving this year. I cannot blame our weather, and my neglect on the nursery.
Many people go to one of these nurseries from our area, and purchase the roses directly. I do believe that the plants that they can purchase in person are much larger than what they ship.
Sammy
Sammy - Thank you. I do hope your roses start doing better soon. Mine are doing better since our recent rains. I am excited about ARE and Chamblees both and am looking forward to ordering from them. I'm sure Rose Petals Nursery is also a good source.
This is the bloom after it opens. Petite, bright pompons that catch your eye all the way across the yard. The flowers last forever and it seems like there's always a couple blooms on the bush. Fragrant too!
Vintage wrote "We now feel that (General Allard) is incorrect, though this rose has much in common with the real General Allard. Our current view is that this may be a seedling of General Allard, possibly even the very famous rose, Mme. Laffay." a.k.a. Morgan St. Pompon. I know it's probably not correct, but I call her Madame Laffay. She needs a feminine name, such a little flirt.
Thank you so much.
Seil, I didn't think about the summer aspect of growing in containers. Got all excited when they started to bloom before the ones in the ground.
That's why I am here, I am glad I found the right place to get advise.
You are very correct, summer will be brutal on the ones in the container. I would love to read the paper you did, will send you my email.
Thanks, Madri
CossecaRose - glad to be of help and very timely for your alfalfa use in your own garden. As Eleanor Roosevelt said, "Learn from the mistakes of others - you can't live long enough to make them all yourself". Of course in my case, there's the quote, "Good decisions come from experience. Unfortunately, experience usually comes from bad decisions."
You're right Susanne that this was a collection of unfortunate events, but I'm vowing not to do the same next year, or even for the remainder of this one. And thanks for the allowance of one major mistake at least per year Hoovb guilt-free, and for helping to redirect some of the guilt. I still think folks like CossecaRose in zone 3 have it way tougher than I do, since most if not all of the HTs simply won't survive that cold without hauling inside protection for the winter, and I can get away with even teas if I'm careful. Still we do have our challenges in Nebraska, but at least for the time being we have plenty of water. A major storm headed for our area missed us thankfully, so we may actually have a whole dry week to recover.
Thanks again everyone!
Cynthia
Sorry to hear about the violence :( Anyone cruel enough to hurt a defenseless animal is a menace to society and needs to be caught and punished.
This might not suit your needs, but I thought I'd mention it. My neighbor who has had trouble with neighborhood dogs going after his chickens installed cameras that required no wiring. He said they are available anyplace you would find hunting equipment. They are motion sensitive, battery operated, and just have an internal memory card. He has them mounted on tree trunks.
Rat dogs
We tested one of the game cameras. They do work great but want to be north facing and the street is north facing. So we got every car that drove by. Lol.
I am going to put up signs that say under 24hr security camera etc. You would be amazed at how much just posting signs change what people do.