22,796 Garden Web Discussions | Roses

Add to all of the above that the majority of the Buck roses were introduced by Roses of Yesterday and Today, a nursery well known for using a contract grower who infamously used infected Dr. Huey root stock to produce everything. Years before the original nursery ceased operations (the current version is owned and operated by descendants of the last original owner/operator, and has little to do with the original other than in name), I visited them and toured their growing grounds. There were hundreds of three gallon, paper pulp potted roses and symptoms in every row of plants. I have personal experience with an Earth Song which was given to the gentleman from whom I obtained it by Dr. Buck himself, at Iowa State. It is virused. The man from whom I obtained it never budded it. He received it infected. So, if you hope to find any of the Buck roses (except, perhaps the later ones introduced in the nineties and later, but no guaranty) uninfected, it's pretty much going to have to be one which has been put through the treatment program somewhere to eliminate RMV. Like the majority of the AARS roses, which came out through Armstrong Roses (and were infected by them), the Bucks came to market infected. I haven't grown one yet which didn't show symptoms in my climate. Kim

Thank you all for the replies and info. I originally learned of Buck roses on these forums and they seemed well suited for my area as I am in Iowa. At this point, I will keep my eye on it and see whether or not it has reduced vigor and decide what to do from there. I also asked local growers about experiences growing an infected Buck roses here.

This is indeed a helpful thread for all gardeners. Using organic products is the best way to keep your skin fresh and shining.

Toi have no skin problems, I have used pure chimp super body cream which is 100% natural.

I on the other hand, found direct sunlight to be the driver in out zone 6a garden. Its probably due to the weather. We don't have the long growing season of south California and even most of May was cloudy with drizzle. So the true sunny days are precious.

This post was edited by mikeber on Mon, May 26, 14 at 22:01

I'm inland SF bay area. During the summer months, we alternate between cool weather with the marine layer and frying with 100+ weather. The heat makes thing happen too fast once the HT start their growth spurt. Ideally, the heat get things going and it will cool off so I can enjoy the blooms. We don't get as long a growing season as Scal

Bewitched can be very pretty, when it's pretty. Yours is the nicest I've ever seen! You did well! Kim

Very nice! :)

There could be any number of reasons for that funky growth but I don't think it's RRD. You got them a couple of weeks ago and planted them right away. We had some frost warnings just a couple of weeks ago, did you too? That looks like cold damage to new growth in my opinion.

As far as the thorns are concerned, some roses ARE thornier than others. I don't see anything like the massive thorniness of RRD. You wouldn't be able to see much of any green cane at all between the thrones on RRD canes.

You need to relax and be patient and let this poor thing warm up and really start growing.

Thanks for the responses,

They did not come potted - just in plastic bags to protect the roots.

I don't believe it could be cold damage as we haven't gotten below 40 degrees in some time. I was actually a little concerned because the usual ship time is in April and I didn't get them until the 6th of May. First week I had them the temps were in the 60s 70s which is rather warm for planting roses according to my reading?

Does flushing the soil mean shoving a hose in the ground and running it for a while? Sorry if that's a silly question.

The weather change should be good for the CT Rose Show, which moved up a week this year, as many gardens were bloomed out by the time to the show. While the stems might not be as long, I look forward to seeing different varieties at the show.

Funny,
I've always thought fall bloom is our best. Spring is always a fight against weeds and weather.

Fall bloom comes more slowly, bloom sizes can be huge without heavy fertilizer (just cooler days) and better color because the sun's rays aren't as intense. Also no hail storms. No late Easter Freeze. No really hungry dear and their fauns. Slower caterpillars.

I guess Fall for the win.

To add to mg's comments, if you can get out there and wipe before too much damage is done, they don't multiply and make things worse. Quicker you can smash them the better. Wear some thin nitrile gloves if squishing bothers you.

thanks guys!

You could always pinch off the blooms and float them in a crystal bowl. If you remove the buds the first year, the plant can focus on root production.

Here is a link that might be useful: Removing buds on first year plants

Hello everybody, and thank you all for the replies :)
Despite what it looks like, the rose bush is 3-5 years old.
The reason it is so small is because the fools at brookfields nursery kept pruning them EXTREMELY hard, all the time!
I already cut the flowers at the sides leaving one-third of the stem with a few leaves. sorry... >_>
I left the middle stem untouched, tho.
It does not seem to have suffered any shock, tho.

This post was edited by NOACCEPTANCE772 on Mon, May 26, 14 at 11:36

Ah! We have a winner! Fragrant Delight! This is exactly it.

Thank you so much for all the help- I now need to find a supplier, as my local grower does not carry it, to my surpriseâ¦Its one of the best in the midwest, and alas- no luck

Wonderful! You're welcome, happy to help. The endearing image of you & your children enjoying this rose in your garden, completing the circle of nostalgic past with unfolding present, brings a smile to my heart.

Roses Unlimited in South Carolina lists Fragrant Delight. They supply gallon plants growing on their own roots rather than grafted & are well-respected, earning a Top 5 rating at Garden Watchdog.

Fragrant Delight is an all-around winner in many ways - beautiful & generous bloom early to frost, delightful fragrance & health & won several awards at the time including the Edland fragrance medal. Thank you for reminding me of its charms! Now I'm seeking this truly delightful rose for this garden, too.

Here is a link that might be useful: Roses Unlimited Roses A-Z

I remember doing something similar with a Peace rose years ago! But now he is a total enabler and doesn't say a word if I say I need a particular rose. Makes life easier!

I love your choices. When I was using spray, I had a red and white front garden. I had a circle of white roses, and on the outside of the circle in beds or alone, I had my red roses.

Europeana was outstanding, Chrysler Imperial was also a beauty, and reminded me of my father's garden in Indiana. Oklahoma is also beautiful, but did not like me garden.

I had other colors in the back or side of the yard. I do not remember Intrigue or Fragrant Cloud, but do remember the names.

I think you have some real winners in your roses.

Sammy

Hi Jameya

Boy - things move quickly when I haven't logged in for a day or two! You're right that most of these canes need to be pruned down. All three canes in picture #1 probably need to be taken down to mostly at the ground, though you might be able to stop just before the growth I see at the base. You want to see mostly green cane with mostly cream colored centers after you prune. In picture #2, you can see the growth dying off at the end of the two smaller canes and these need to be taken down to the ground. The center cane might have an inch or so of good cane left - you could try cutting just above a swelling I see toward the base of the cane and see if it will resprout. So far, it isn't showing many good signs of growth. The last picture has a little better cane on the back larger cane, but those brown streaks look like trouble in the making. I'd cut that front shorter cane all the way to the ground, and you'd need to at least trim the back cane down to where the growth starts to the right. In my garden, I'd trim further down to where the growth starts to the left, but some of those streaks might turn out OK. Usually it's a sign of something that gets worse, so if there's still healthy cane below it, I'm always prone to cut more so there's less danger of spreading.

Hope this helps
Cynthia

From what I understood, "catnip" and "catmint" are somewhat interchangeable terms for various species in the Nepeta genus. The species that's more specifically known as "catnip" is Nepeta cataria, and that seems to be the one in your seed packets. I agree that it will spread, and isn't particularly attractive (at least, compared to other species in the genus). I planted a few cultivars of Nepeta here in my new garden:

'Dropmore Hybrid'
'Little Titch'
'Six Hills Giant'
'Walker's Low'

There are a few others out there, but a piece of frugal advice -- if you're a patient gardener, don't buy more than one per cultivar. They are easily propagated -- in my last garden a few years back, I'd simply snip stems and stick them in the ground in Spring, and most rooted and grew. I've tried this a few times again here, and so far, so good.

One other piece of advice regarding any species in the Nepeta genus -- while N. cataria is the one most commonly grown specifically as a "cat tonic", cats will often find other species attractive as well. Keep this in mind when planting them in the garden, because cats will often roll around in the plants and squash them to the ground. I've been battling that issue here (a woman a few doors down feeds strays.....grrrr), and found that what seems to work is to build a "fence" around each plant with some tree branches stuck in the ground. I think that as my roses mature, I'll start sticking Nepeta stems in the ground at their bases -- the Nepeta will cover any naked legs on the roses, and the roses' thorns will (hopefully) deter the cats. We'll see....

:-)

~Christopher

You might wanna show this to Paul zimmerman. LOL
He shown that own root roses establish quicker than budded/grafted roses, but it always occurred to me, "What if the root stock and scion are not compatible?" which might of been why his Grafted/budded rose did so poorly?
But this is awesome :P I my self am preparing root stocks for some budding and grafting of my own :)

Thank you! Paul and I saw when walking the Ashdown fields in Wasco, the year Arena budded his plants there, some varieties simply didn't require budding. In particular, Mme. Alfred Carriere generated inch and thicker canes on those budded plants the first summer after budding. Others pushed begrudging inches of thin growth. It all depends upon the genetics of the rose, how suitable it is for where it's being grown and under what conditions. For every variety you give me that doesn't require it, I can probably give you one which does.

Here, and in many other less cold severe, longer season areas, many own root plants are going to do wonderfully. Put the same roses in shorter, harsher season areas and they fail. We've all read the posts from forum responders here about how they won't bother with own root plants because they don't flourish in their climates and conditions. Just as we've read those which won't touch budded plants for their stated reasons. But, you have to take your cues from the rose. Most WILL root, but not all will grow well own root. If you want to be sure to get what you're trying to propagate, you're best off trying several methods of propagation. Not all are going to succeed in every situation with every rose, everywhere. I received material from two of this series from the same person at that time. I struck both and budded both. The second variety failed as cuttings, but buds on another piece of Pink Clouds remained green and have only begun pushing growth this year. It's now starting to flower. It's also mildewing up a storm, which might well mean it isn't something I really want to use for breeding, but we'll see. As with the other, I inserted multiple buds on the same, longer whip of Pink Clouds. My goal wasn't to create a garden ready plant of either, but to establish them in my garden so I could begin playing with them. Once you have one plant, you're set! Then, you can generate virtually as many as you want. Also, as with the other Ruffle variety, I intend to cut up the budded pieces of this one to root individually this winter. I know I'll have one budded low, and very possibly other budded plants if I can successfully pull off rooting them. I don't put multiple varieties on the same stock. If one is virused, then all the others are likely then to be also. But, I will put multiples of the same variety on the same stock.

Yes, incompatibility between scion and stock might result in issues with the rose settling in. So could how the budded plant was held prior to planting. If it's held too dry and experiences desiccation prior to planting, there will be issues. We've all experienced where the plant sat there, dying back, drying out instead of breaking into growth. If the rose is one with strongly Foetida genetics, it's a kiss of death. Think Peace, Grey Pearl, Angel Face, Sterling Silver and all other lavenders, yellows and Pernetiana types. Foetida genes hate cold, dry storage. It's been strongly suggested for years this could well be why bare roots of those types are often seen as "devitalized" and often never regain their original vigor.

There are simply too many variables involved to accurately state own roots will establish faster and better than budded, OR vice versa. You can demonstrate that very often, MANY roses will establish and provide you with more propagation and garden use material faster if budded, compared to own root. (I don't blame you for grafting your own!) Kim

Possible causes are verticillium wilt (a soil-borne disease that clogs the plumbing) or something wrong with the cane stub that underlies the dying cane (canker or insect damage). In eastern zone 7 and colder there was a lot of winter damage this year, but unlikely in zone 8.

V-wilt sounds like a real possibility. I have had it in two roses, which developed resistance (immune reaction) and survived. Canes die back separately to the crown or graft. You can look up images.

I have also thought of stem canker but I don't see it on the affected stems.

You're probably right seil - being mean but this stuff takes soporific to a whole new level. I struggle to find any relevance to a gardener. This is after all a garden forum. These are dull, university papers posted continuously. Can you hand on heart say you've ploughed through any of this stuff and come out the other end having gained anything?

There are rose diseases out there that are important to those of us in North America. What is in the scientific papers (Yes, I do read them) is important to many of us for the continued health and survival of our gardens.

Do a search about Downey Mildew. Then do a search about Chili Thrips. Then look to Rose Rosette.

Then thank your lucky stars that so far, these pestilences aren't being propagated in your part of the rose world by people who can't be bothered to learn about both the good and bad sides of rose growing.