21,402 Garden Web Discussions | Roses

First, have you sprayed it with ANYTHING other than hose water? If so, what, when and with what?
Second, have you fertilized it with ANYTHING in the past month? If so, what, when and how much?
Third, do you have gophers, moles or voles? Have you checked around the bases of the fried, dried out canes to make sure nothing has gnawed through the bark and cambium (circulatory system) layer, girdling them? If the cambium layer is severed all around the cane, the top will dry up like what you're seeing.
Have you had any construction work done which might have resulted in any paint, paint remover, solvents or cement bucket wash water being poured or dumped anywhere near that plant?
Have you had any excavation done anywhere near it? Such as digging out a sprinkler line or something like that?
The plant looks to me as if it has saw fly larvae, which accounts for the little holes in the foliage. The dried out foliage and canes look like what you should expect either from being fried during an extreme heat spell with insufficient water. Or, the roots have been severed either by a shovel, or being eaten off by gophers or voles, or severely loosened by a lot of mole activity. Or, something has eaten the bark and cambium around them toward their bases. We get that issue in winter here from mice eating pittosporums that way, causing huge dead spots in their canopies.
Or, the plant has been chemically burned, either by something being dumped in the soil near enough to it to kill the roots. Or, it has been fried by being sprayed with something it didn't like. Or, salty fertilizer has been thrown against the bottoms of the canes at their bases. A clump of granular fertilizer resting against the cane can draw all the water out of it, replacing it with salt. If too much fertilizer has been applied in its root zone, it will draw water out of the plant, replacing it with salts which "burn" the plant. That can look just like what you have in the photo. Or, if fertilizer was applied to it when it was too dry, then watered in, the plant could be desiccated as you've shown. Fertilizers should be used on well watered plants, then watered in. Never on dry plants then watered in. That results in your watering the plant with salty water and will very likely burn them, like what yours looks like in the photos.
As you can see, there are a number of issues it COULD be. Only you can supply the information necessary to help determine what the issue might be. Thanks. Kim

Yeah, I do foliar feeding as an extra measure in case the roots have any problems taking up nutrients. That's one big reason I started, and then I heard that it might help BS.
I enjoy it, too :) I use fish emulsion and it smells like the beach, lol. Clearly it's not going to be enjoyable for everyone, because it does smell like dead fish!
I use a mix of fish+kelp bottled gunk, milk and water. The milk was originally added for BS control. I like the overall results very much, but I can't promise that it 'really' works for fungal problems.
I try to do it every two weeks. That stretches to about 3 weeks often on many of my roses. It reminds me of a day fishing at the beach, with the strong smell and the sun and heat :D :D


We had a Styro Foam food shipping container left over from a Christmas present, with the outer cardboard box. The lamb was well frozen and freezer packaged. One pound of dry ice and the lamb were all that would fit inside. It was all sealed, then sealed inside the outer cardboard box. His name and address were on it and a nylon strap with metal handle was tied around it so it could be carried on board like luggage. He set it on the belt to be XRayed and the TSA agent got a sick look on his face. You KNOW what he thought it was. My buddy told him it was lamb and why he was flying with it, and that it only contained one pound of dry ice, which they could see in the XRay. The other agent asked if he could open it and began untying the strap, which was tied in multiple knots as it was too long for the package. He told the agent he was welcomed to, as long as HE tied it all back securely as it was. The agent decided it wasn't worth it and the lamb and my friend were on their way to the plane. I still laugh at the thought of the agent seeing 'chopped up meat' inside a box with dry ice going through his machine... They THINK they've seen it all! LOL! Kim

GFVeggie, I agree with Buford. If you like the fungicide, the Bayer product with just the fungicide is the way to go, imho. You don't want a nasty mite breakout by using insecticides when they aren't needed, either.
I use the fungicide-only on a handful of roses a couple (to three) times in the wet and cool spring. It works well. Then it gets so hot here, I don't need the big guns. I wait till I see the disease show up in the spring, even. I really like the product compared to earlier synthetics, because it works on existing infections.
Mainly I try to avoid chemicals, but I'm more IPM than organic. I always try to avoid insecticides when possible, because most of the killing of the bad bugs in my garden is done by the beneficial insects and spiders! I'm lazy that way :D

This is the fungicide-only version, in the attached link:
Here is a link that might be useful: Bayer fungicide-only for roses

The Prince really is a great color! I used to grow him.
I still grow Othello, and he gets really purple later in the bloom stage. He starts out more red at first, at least for me. I love the later color, and he grows better for me than The Prince did.
The Prince didn't like me very much. He wouldn't get bigger, ever.


I don't get the slamming of Knockout either. Do people refer only to the original or to all of the sports and follow-ons? I had plenty of teas and other roses when I planted Blush Knockout, including some with very simple blooms like Lyda Rose and Darwin's Enigma and Pleasantrie and I was quite happy with the Blush KO. Matter of fact, of that particular group, it's the only one I still have.
As to what's available in stores, I don't shop in stores for roses, so I have no idea. However, I would think it's better to have those available than most of the hybrid teas and floribundas that have been sold over the years that require constant spraying.
Actually, I do have a single nomination for most overrated rose - Peace. Grows well in dry desert. Otherwise defoliates within hours. Chicago Peace has the same problem but on top of that it's ugly. I made the mistake of planting those a number of years ago.
Gone.

bluegirl,
You said:
"Unamended, the clay dried to brick-hard texture but gypsum made it much more crumbly & compost & leaf mold added regularly eventually converted it into a rich friable soil."
Did you add compost and leaf mold regularly or did you add Gypsum, Compost, and Leaf Mold regularly?
The reason I ask is that one marketer of the pelletized gypsum said that it shouldn't be added regularly, just once or maybe twice....And NO!, I don't know why.
andrea

I don't want to misinform you, so I'd go by the label instructions, but...
As I recall things: we added it as needed to break up the soil enough to do planting, then improved the soil itself with constantly added organic amendments like cow manure, rotted oak leaves, rotten hay, etc. I remember using it quite a bit initially, much less in later years. Once the top soil had improved, I added gypsum only occasionally as needed, like at the bottom of holes, where the heavy clay was still evident.
I *think* gypsum itself affects soil pH little (or only slightly acidifies--an advantage to me, as our clay was alkaline). I think as it reacts in the soil it leaves available Ca to plants. I don't recall the negatives of using too much. We used it a lot initially, less so later, but always used it whenever we thought the soil texture warranted it. It was a fine product that worked well in our situation.
If you can talk to local gardeners or nurserymen, they could give you better advice for your soil/climate.

What a gorgeous picture! Of the old roses, polyanthas (at least some of them) do stay small and can easily be grown in pots. Little White Pet is an excellent one, but there are many others. Their flowers are also on the small side, but there will be many of them. Some of the early hybrid teas are also smaller plants (La France being a lovely and very fragrant example) that you might try in pots.
Ingrid

Elina (yellow), older HT loves the heat, Pink Pet, White Pet, Clotilde Soupert, and Leonie Lamesch. Ducher (white) has stayed relatively small for me. Elina is on Fortuniana, but the others are own-root. Red cascade does as the name suggests, but it will spill out of the pot and then start crawling across the ground unless you keep it pruned. All of these are very healthy here.

My sister's HOA in Santa Clarita has kept both white and yellow Banksiae machetted into shrubs for over thirty years. They pave' themselves with flowers every spring, but require being hacked several times annually to maintain the size and shape. I've seen walls planted with Banksiae in Pacific Palisades where the Banksiae have been maintained for many years only two feet thick and manicured to fit the angles of the house walls. It CAN be done, but it requires vigilance to maintain it. Once it gets away from you, it's difficult to regain the density of "green", with woody holes replacing it. It's honestly more maintenance than I would care to provide it. But, it CAN be done. Kim

Kim describes it perfectly. You see it around here frequently, but usually in locations where paid landscapers stay on top of it.
I wouldn't do it because:
1. I am a lazy gardener, and I avoid all that work like the plague; and . . .
2. I really do prefer them looking wild.
As we age, the garden becomes less-disciplined with every passing year, so it's probably a good thing that I like "un-restrained" plants. :-)
Jeri


" Once the weather cools down we will transplant it. We're in a heat wave right now."
Wait a minute. You probably won't NEED to move it. I asked about increased heat and sun. Now, you make that statement above. Once your temps cool down to "normal", you'll very likely have your yellow flowers. Build shade; plant shade; buy a new one for a shadier spot or even a yellow rose, but yours will be yellow again when your weather gets back to "normal". Kim


Thanks for getting back to me. I wasn't sure anyone would see this since it wasn't a new post.
I'm happy for the good news especially since I lost some more roses over the winter. As hard as it is, I'm trying to be smarter in my choices.
Thanks for your help,
kitty

Hi sunflowers, I'd give your Peace two cups of alfalfa horse pellets (not the alfalfa pellets intended for rabbits/guinea pigs, those contain salt -- go to a feed store and get horse pellets) and water, water, water. The combination of alfalfa and LOTS of water should produce some new canes from the base. Next spring, you can shorted everything to about three feet and your bush will look 'bushier'. HTs tend to be lanky, but you want to encourage new basal canes each year.
Then you're left with about twenty pounds of alfalfa horse pellets in the bag (twenty pounds minus two cups). You can use the alfalfa to fertilize your lawn, veggies, flower beds, etc. Scatter it to lightly cover the soil surface, don't get too generous or you can burn plants. Good luck!

Thank you so much everyone. I really appreciate it. Going to make a trip to the feed store for some alfalfa horse pellets and then get something for the fungus. Yes I do get a lot of black spots on the leaves. None of my other rose bushes get them. Just this peace rose. I just checked it a bit ago and 2 of the 3 canes are dead. Just nearly black so I cut them all the way down. The center of those canes were brown. Don't know what happened but only one of the canes looks good now. That one cane is still nice and green like a green apple and is as thick as my thumb. This one rose bush has always baffled me. Thanks for all of your help everyone. Again I appreciate it.








It certainly looks like good old Dr. Huey to me. His roots are like asparagus...they can lay dormant in the soil for YEARS until conditions improve. Then, he will explode into mildewy, rusty growth in most places. If you like him, by all means grow him. Otherwise, it's time for the Round Up. You know how long his roots laid there, waiting for you to water. Think you can actually dig them ALL out? hehehe Kim
Seil- Only going by what the neighbor told me, there was only the one rose bush there. So definitely suckers then, yes? Im going to put the trellis up this weekend. Should I prune it back some first or no? Thank you!!