21,402 Garden Web Discussions | Roses

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roseseek

You're welcome! I wouldn't try to base that kind of identification on scent. Scents (and noses) are too variable and fleeting. Plus, what scent name is given in the registration is up to the nose of the person filling out the form. What good is it if their nose isn't any "better" than yours, or if what they perceive as one scent, isn't what others perceive? Give me quantifiable characteristics any day! Kim

    Bookmark   March 24, 2013 at 2:21AM
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Ronn Bonites

Exactly! I wouldn't have identified my red HT as Olympiad if it wasn't for someone pointing it out to me that it has no scent to them.It did resemble Olympiad in all its attributes (heat-resistance, bloom form, leaves) but the only thing that made me suspend my judgement was that it was listed as having a mild tea scent which my rose didn't posses. Visual characteristics are easier to look out for.

    Bookmark   March 24, 2013 at 4:05AM
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Kippy(SoCal zone 10. Sunset Zone 24)

Kate,

I guess some one passed a county rule around here, but I personally can spray RU, if my gardener does (and does not have a current pesticide use permit/license/class) it is a $250 fine for the first offence. In the city gas powered leaf blowers are also off limits.

I read a paper for a foo foo small town north of here, seems homeowners using hedge clippers on the weekend is also a big no-no and will have your neighbors calling the police on you. (makes their blotter reports several times each weekend)

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 6:11PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

In parts of New York State (and I think the City of New York) Roundup may not be used. A wise law, I think. I wish we had it.

Jeri

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 9:37PM
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lucillle

I sure would like a deer or two in the freezer.

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 4:23PM
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seil zone 6b MI

Lol, Lucille, that's the only way I like them too!

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 4:26PM
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ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9

It's the beginning of the most exciting time of the rose year and, best of all, I have many baby roses that will bloom for the first time this spring (I hope!). I'm most excited about Young Lycidas, Lady Alice Stanley, Earth Song and Pink Rosette.

Ingrid

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 7:25PM
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jim1961 Zone 6a Central Pa.

In the 30's here with snow still on the ground...:(

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 1:55PM
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ken-n.ga.mts(7a/7b)

Roses Unlimited in Laurens, S.C. is a must for you. They carry a BUNCH of climbers that do great in you're area. They have a great web site. Have fun :)

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 5:25PM
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lsst(7b)

I second Roses Unlimited in Laurens SC.

I live about an hour a way so even if you are a couple of hours away, it is worth it.

When I was creating a parterre rose garden two years ago,I attended RU's spring open house and purchased all of my roses there.

They grow own root.

Their open house should be some time in April.

As for a climber, one of my favorites is Abraham Darby. For me, it is an apricot rose and has very few thorns.

Hope this helps.

    Bookmark   March 23, 2013 at 2:47AM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Sorry -- I am fragrance-challenged. I've never been able to smell L.P. -- my fault, not that of the rose.

Jeri

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 12:11AM
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kittymoonbeam

What about a temporary panel to cover the wall until the rose builds up. Or maybe a structure that provides light shade until the bush is larger. Once it's nice and big, the structure could be taken down. Might look out of place for a while, but the years of beautiful rose to follow would be worth it.

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 9:52PM
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lola-lemon(5b East WA)

That's great news for you! It's probably going to be fine.
Iceberg should be planted above ground in your warm climate. NOT like the picture says.

Let it take it's time.!

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 3:30PM
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roseseek

Quite often, bare roots dry out before they have a chance to develop the feeder roots so they can absorb sufficient water. Grab a bag of planting mix and dump it over the rose so you bury the green canes almost their entire length. Keep that mound of soil over the plant damp when you water until new growth begins showing, when you can gradually uncover the plant. You can make cylinders of card board or many layers of news paper stapled into the size cylinder necessary to permit filling it with soil so only the top two or so inches of the canes are exposed. Water into the cylinder so the contained soil remains damp.

It isn't necessary every time to mound newly planted bare roots like this, but where it's likely to be windy, arid, warm, brilliantly sunny where the plant is going to have to battle being pushed into growth too early before it can generate roots, it helps greatly. It's the same theory as planting the callused, wrapped cuttings deeply in pots or cups to prevent them from drying out or being pushed into too early growth before they can grow roots. Bare root body bags used to have those instructions on them. It's been so long since I've even looked at rose a body bag, I don't know if they're still there or not. The main causes of bare root failure are receiving or buying dried out, nearly dead plants and exposing them to desiccating conditions without proper protection against drying out before they can grow roots.

Trevor Griffiths, the nurseryman from New Zealand, wrote in one of his books of people who would bring back "dead" bare roots. He would bury them under soil to rehydrate them then pot them to take to speaking engagements to show how "dead" they were. I frequently bought "dead" returned bare roots for fifty cents from work years ago because I knew I could bury them a few weeks, then plant and nearly every one of them lived to become decent plants. It honestly IS hard to kill a rose...as long as you know what you're doing. Kim

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 6:59PM
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erasmus_gw

Nice plants. Pink Rosette is very interesting.

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 9:54AM
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lesmc

Thanks for posting this...they look wonderful. Happy planting and Happy Spring!! Lesley

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 1:42PM
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billsgarden13(5, Chicago, IL)

To all:

I just heard back from the seller (Hirt's Gardens) and they responded that they don't carry any grafted roses- so this is an own root with just one heck of a basal shoot!

Thanks again for all of your help and insight!

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 9:51AM
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jacqueline9CA

So glad you figured it out. A clue for future reference is that the new growth (red) on the older cane looks just like the new growth (red) on the new cane. It does NOT look at all like Dr. Huey, the most used rootstock, which (at least here) produces new leaves that are green with red edges.

Jackie

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 1:35PM
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susan4952(5)

Hi Ed. Use the search feature at the bottom of this page. Tons of start to finish info. Stored on this site. Have fun and welcome to the addiction.

    Bookmark   March 19, 2013 at 10:58PM
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rosetom(7 Atl)

I posted in your other thread, but I have a slightly different take on the holes in red clay. Done properly, Dr. Huey may actually prefer red clay than other soils. ;-) In my experience, deep is better than wide - may have to do with what's already been mentioned about roses needing to drain. I actually put a few small pebbles at the bottoms of my holes just to ensure that there's some drainage below the roots - but my holes are deep - 2 feet minimum, sometimes more. I also don't mix as much other stuff in with the clay as others do - about 30% peat moss with a cup of Mills Mix and that's it. If the rose roots can drain well, they'll like the red clay just fine and have no trouble growing through it, around it, and all over. The last thing I do is mulch - mulch, mulch, mulch. Shredded pine bark is best. It holds its shape pretty well. I mound it up in the center (no issue with shredded pine bark touching the canes) and then create large, 3-foot donut drip rings. When it breaks down, it forms organics that the roses love. I think they even love the smell. ;-)

Others are right, though, if you completely replace the soil in the red clay hole, you're doing little more than creating an in-ground clay pot.

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 9:55AM
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Ed Spangler

thanks mzstitch, will use your advice, what can I do for the 4 estaoblished rose bushes? One Yellow 3 Red?? What should I feed them during Spring /Summer??? By the way, my brother in law lives in York!! Also have friends in Kings Mountain and Rock Hill, email me and I will tell you their names, you may know them.
Thanks
Ed

    Bookmark   March 20, 2013 at 1:10PM
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rosetom(7 Atl)

I agree that there should be nothing wrong with red clay and roses. Dr. Huey simply loves it. As others have said, though, hole preparation is important. Even though I'm in Atlanta, I bury every bud union at least a couple of inches below the surface.

Then I mulch, mulch, mulch - shredded pine bark works best for me. It breaks down in about a third to a half-season, but it retains shape well and doesn't wash away easily. I mound up the center quite a bit (there's no issue with shredded pine mulch against the canes) and then form a large drip ring around the center - like a 3-foot donut.

BTW, for newly planted bare roots - you should cover the canes completely with a center mound of mulch. Let the canes and shoots find their way out. That protects the bush until the roots gain some footing.

No one's said it yet, but all the talk about "feeding" may be a bit much. Use organics and lay off the hard fertilizer until you know you have an established bush - and even then use it sparingly. I can't say enough about Magic Mills Mix from Beaty fertilizer (you can get it from Rosemania, too). The stuff is great. I use a cup mixed with about 30% peat moss in the red clay to replace the soil in the hole. That's after removing all the rocks, by the way. Ensuring that the hole is deep rather than wide seems to work best in my clay.

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 9:43AM
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Ronn Bonites

Bumping this thread. Thanks again for the suggestions everyone!

This post was edited by Resolute_Noir on Sun, Mar 17, 13 at 11:51

    Bookmark   March 14, 2013 at 6:52AM
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Ronn Bonites

So today, I just found out about R. bracteata and it was apparently native to my country. (I'm gonna look for it everywhere here whenever I go out of town from now on!)

My question now is...
Any recommendations on Hybrid Bracteatas?
Also, would R. bracteata be good for breeding?

    Bookmark   March 22, 2013 at 6:39AM
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roseseek

Many food plants aren't easily available anymore not so much due to their genetic instability as to their lack of being financially profitable. The only way to make a plant type economically worthwhile is to possess a patent on it. Once that patent expires, you need others to take its place to continue the cash stream.

Often, older varieties are less resistant to disease and/or insect infections which may not have been issues when they were widely grown. Here in the west, we have Pierce's Disease, which was discovered near Anaheim in 1892 on grapes. It wasn't a huge threat until Glassy Winged Sharp Shooters, native to the South Eastern US were discovered to have made it across country in 1996. We had older varieties of grapes which could still be grown for a century until the wide spread pest began spreading the fatal disease throughout the susceptible types. We now have fatal diseases in citrus due to the same reason...foreign pests spreading them. Look at what is happening to Oleanders here in California. They were the perfect "weed"...toxic so NOTHING ate them; able to endure rather deep cold and blistering heat; able to exist on relatively little water; requiring virtually nothing to thrive and provide many months of unending color...until Oleander Leaf Scorch arrived, also spread by Glassy Winged Sharp Shooters. It's the Oleander strain of the same bacteria which causes Pierce's Disease, spread by the same insect. There was 12' - 15' tall, 50' long hedge of Oleanders out behind this house from the late fifties until four years ago. They existed on only rainfall and provided an excellent wind and privacy barrier. Over the period of four years, they flat out died from the Leaf Scorch. Oleander hedges all over the valley show the effects of the disease. Some nurseries aren't selling Oleanders any more due to the disease.

Many older fruit and vegetable varieties are much less resistant to bacterial and fungal attacks making them more costly and difficult to raise or even maintain. "Resistant" is a huge marketing word when advertising any plant type. Unless you are insistent upon getting the exact older type you desire, most purchasers opt for "resistant" to diseases and pests over heirloom fruit, particularly when the less resistant cost more because they are more expensive to maintain and produce.

Some aren't kept around because of greater cultural requirements or greater space requirements. For rose standards, IXL was the trunk stock of choice for many decades because it generates tremendous growth of very thick canes very quickly, but it also requires significantly greater room to grow mother plants and is much more susceptible to sun scald than Dr. Huey. IXL makes a better standard in less time, but Huey is the standard stock in use now because it requires less room to produce and is cheaper due to less sun scald loss.

Some are being lost due to climate change. Sweet cherries are now not as successful in the more southern orchards because of insufficient winter chill and too great summer heat, as well as insufficient rainfall. If the heat continues pressing northward, it's entirely possible the high chill requiring types may be lost in favor of less winter chill types because there won't BE orchards with enough cold. Plants and animals are already moving north, taking advantage of the milder conditions where the more extremes used to prevent them success. Kim

    Bookmark   March 21, 2013 at 9:14PM
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bluegirl_gw

In addition to losing ancient foundation stock & seeds in plants, it's a concern with livestock, too. England & Europe have scores of breeds of chickens, cattle, sheep & pigs adapted for small homesteads or severely restricted environments. The Rare Breeds Conservatory tries to preserve these treasures from extinction.

The book RARE BREEDS is a gorgeous picture book of some wonderful representatives of old livestock. There is a Scottish sheep that lives on SEAWEED most of the year, White Park cows that were familiar to the Romans, maybe even the Druids, four-horned Jacob sheep, etc. . Africa & India are also reservoirs of some incredible cattle breeds--gigantic-horned Watusi cows, many races of Zebus ranging from milk breeds to draft animals (In the U.S. we simply call all humped cattle "Brahmas"--the rest of the world recognizes they have distinct races--Nelore, Indu-Brazil, Gyr, etc.)

Sorry for the tangent, but the effort to preserve the precious genetic heritage of endangered roses & livestock (not just the more publicized preservation of wildlife & food crops) is really interesting (at least to me!)

As J. L. Hudson puts it: "Preservation through dissemination"

    Bookmark   March 21, 2013 at 11:10PM
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Campanula UK Z8

Maigold - an outstanding climber with excellent disease resistance.

    Bookmark   March 21, 2013 at 5:12PM
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Gabrielsyme

Maigold looks gorgeous but probably won't grow in my region.

I'm thinking about Quadra because it's such a vigorous climber and I want something cane-hardy so that it will get big enough to cover the house.

What I really want to know is weather or not this is a reasonable possibility. Most nurseries list it (and pretty much all other climbers) as topping out around 12'. Is this true? I've seen several pictures of Quadra that look like it's growing much higher.

    Bookmark   March 21, 2013 at 8:44PM
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roseseek

Rogue Valley has the precise one you seek, but not propagated right now. From their web site: Kim

This is a recent rediscovery in an abandoned garden on Alcatraz Island by Gregg Lowery and Phillip Robinson. The plant that we have is still quite young but already is showing the characteristics that they site: vigorous, floriferous, fragrant. The blooms are almost black red.

Here is a link that might be useful: RVR Bardou Job

    Bookmark   March 21, 2013 at 8:24PM
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