6,340 Garden Web Discussions | Growing from Seed
Okay, my brother finally emailed me back. He is a man of few words, and this was his reply.
The seed pods will continue to mature until they sort of start turning brownish. Then take them off and let them dry and then keep them in a plastic baggy until spring. See attached pic.
Here is his picture of the seeds.
Very cool! Love to see the seeds. I have brought my Mandevilla in the house already because we have had some VERY cold evenings already in MN. I didn't have any seeds, but I am going to try to start new plants by taking some cuttings and dipping them in root hormone and some additional clipping and put them in grow gel. I will also take some and just put them in water with maybe some miracle grow. I guess we will see if I get lucky! I am excited to get a new Madevilla next spring so there can be cross pollination maybe. The Audubon Society is hosting a class in my town on Tuesday and they are teaching all about landscaping and pollinators. Can't wait!!
I don't see any suggestions that stratifying improves germination of Sedum glaucophyllum - although I doubt if a brief moist chill would hurt it either, just would not be necessary.
Sounds a little slow to germinate, can take 2-4 weeks sometimes, surface sown obviously with the size of the seeds. It is not one I've sown myself.
Thanks Zen and Morz for your help!
Slow is fine...I'm doing sort of a hybrid winter sowing experiment this fall.....digging deep holes, cutting bottoms out of water jugs and sinking them directly into the ground.... almost like direct sowing only I won't lose all the tiny seed species so easily :) Hoping the sedum will like this method!
I tried growing those last year (TWICE, from two different sources, SSE and Seeds of Change), with terrible results from each - whcih was surprising, because everytime I looked them up, the information said that it was basically a weed and would grow anywhere. I tried starting them early both indoors and out, as well as a second crop direct sown in areas with different amounts of sun. Not a single plant from either package or any method. Quit now before you invest any more time or money . . .
I am not facing any problems whatsoever and never said anything remotely in that direction. Its just you make no sense in your theories or 3/4 of your thoughts. I do not have the desire to read all you write for it is more like a book to me and I have much better time ways to spend my time, like getting my tomato plants in. Maybe you should take some advice from soulreaver!
Overwatering, too cold, or too hot.
My money is on "too hot".
Even if you get the air temp down around 80 or so, the soil in your flats could be significantly hotter. I have never grown in a green house at all. However I have routinely started seeds in sunny south facing windows. And I have discovered that not all sunny south facing windows are equal.
Where I am now, the sun in my south facing windows is great. So great, in fact, that even though it is October and somewhat chilly out (relatively speaking), the sunward side of my seed starting flats heats up to well over 100F - I measured it at 106F and then panicked.
I have since shaded the sunward side of the flat with folded white paper towels and this has reduced the soil temp on that side by 10F to 15F (over what it is with no shading).
But the air temp isn't much over 78F to 80F. It is the effects of direct sunlight on the flat itself.
My money's on the 100+ temps you were reporting.
Cut open a gala apple for breakfast, and all of the seeds were sprouted. One even had roots. Since reading this thread I have since put it in some dirt with some water. I have the perfect pot for it but couldn't find it quickly so used an old egg carton I was saving for seedlings.
Have you read the history of the Granny Smith Apple? It grew from a seedling in a scrap pile in the corner of an old Woman named Smith. It might grow into a nice apple tree or it may not. Most apple cultivars today started from an unknown seedling. Granny Smith Apples have sprouted seeds in quite often.
The mat itself apparently can't handle things. It just won't heat up more than about 7F above ambient. However it is usually sunny here all day and the sunlight plus the heat mat usually keeps the soil temp right around 80F. It drops at night but that is ok, its daytime temps I need to keep up around 80F.
I've had fair germination of the curry leaf seed. Could have been better and most likely will be next time I try this. I probably will not bother to get a herp thermostat since it is clear that it is the seed mat itself that can't generate the heat, regardless of the wide range built in to the thermostat.
Isn't that just tindora? Or a close relative at least. I can't grow tindora here because it winter kills (and it doesn't seem to be all that productive the first year), but maybe those would be a good substitute.
Of course you'd need a seed source first, LOL!
It isn't a big loss, I planted more seeds as most packets have way more than I could need and I'm usually gifting seeds, but just.... very puzzling.
I can see them most of the day (I spend half the day staring at my precious new garden as I work) and didn't see any bird or insect activity worth noting.
The cups didn't get drier or wetter than the others either for some fast rot or something to happen.
This is totally inexplicable, and I suspect my puzzlement is more from my inexperience. There has to be some explanation, just that I don't know it yet.
If the flats are outside, it's a matter of a few seconds for a bird to come along and grab a few seeds. Peck-peck - given the small surface area of soil in a seed starting flat (per cell) chances are good they'd get a few.
You know what they say - even a blind pig finds an acorn once in awhile.
I just can't imagine trying to keep seedlings alive, in trays, for an entire year! I'm starting some now & try to get them in after several months at the most, for the slowest growers. Summer, being easily fatal, as you mentioned, just experience missing one day of watering, during hot sunny skies, low humidity & drying wind & then it can be fatal dessication...
As you noticed in your #4, you're much better off, using a good quality seed starting mixture. Or buy bulk peat moss, mixing in perlite & vermiculite, according to varying moisture level or drainage needs of the species. Not sure how you protect, over winter, to prevent roots from freezing fatatlity.
Keeping in mind, that you ought to sow with two different species in one tray, at least trying to attempt to put together, those with similar water requirements & sunlight or shade needs.
I'm not sure I would even use shade cloth, unless germination calls for darkness to germinate. but place trays, if it is needed, using high shade, from trees with leaves, even if it be that from Pine.
I think, if you try planting out, long before an entire year has elapsed, stunted in a seed tray if it does survive, your success rate will improve greatly. For example, even those sold at the garden center may have had the benefit of a head start in a greenhouse, but are meant to be planted out, shortly after purchase. Be it autumn, or spring...
& if perennial in nature in particular, they want or need more room to grow their extensive root system, than that of seed starting trays. After all, isn't that why they are usually referred to as 'seed -starting- trays'? hth
I would winter sow them ..native perennials do really well this way . You can space them by seeding thinly and they can stay in the milk jugs for a whole season cycle.
Here is a link that might be useful: Winter sowing FAQ
You realise I am sure that a rose grown from seed will not be the same as the parent plant unless it is a species rose. The plant will take some years to flower and until it does you will not know what it will look like or if it will be worth keeping. The only way to get an identical hybrid rose is by taking a cutting or, as commercial growers do, grafting. It might be a good idea to ask this question over on the rose forum for more expert advice.
Here is a link that might be useful: Rose Forum
Pitimpinai -
Our "cold" is really not as impressive as yours. They'd be in about 40-50 lows for the winter. Would that still work, I wonder?
LilFarmGirl:
I'll have to try that in the spring. Sounds simple enough. I've always had a pretty good germination right -- more often than not with most of the seeds germinating. It's more a matter of whether I have to thin or can I possibly pull one out without disturbing the other, haha.
Zen: I brought the little pot inside to see if that helps. Who knows - by now all of the seeds could have blown away or eaten by the hummingbirds for all I know....and I'm nurturing a pot of soil, lol. I have a bunch of seeds starting now in the window, so I figured what the hell.
The ones at the end in the square seed pot is where the petunias were planted....and where they plan to live forever, seemingly. Frankly, I'm not even sure why I'm starting these right now. At the rate they are popping up, I'll be living in a jungle by January. I only did 1 or 2 seeds per cell but the evening stock, salvia spathacea, pineapple sage, cerinthe and tweedia have all come up.
Not sure what I plan to do with these...
At lows in the 40s, my bet is the seed would just blow away or rot before they can sprout if you tried the "overwintering" thing. Wave petunias are a tad expensive for that!
I had temps getting up well over 100F (soil temps, not air temps) when I had my seed starts in my sunny window. However, it's kind of a window WELL - set about 18" into a nook. I don't know if that concentrates the heat somehow or what. But the sunward side of my seed flat (which is, of course, black) hit 106F before I got scared and tried to shade it with paper towels. Which sort of worked - brought the temp down 10 to 15F.
Now I have them all under lights. And THAT gets way hotter than I would have thought, over 100F sometimes if I don't put the fan on them.
You know I never USED to take so much care with my seedlings. It was into the flats, into a window or under the lights, in a dark, dank old-style basement with old-fashioned buzzing fluorescents hanging from shelves made of cement blocks and lumber - and they came up or they didn't - and they have nearly always come up.
I never owned a heat mat (in over 40 years) until just a month or so ago. Never took soil temp. According to the experts, I did everything WRONG and all my peppers and eggplants and most of my tomatoes should just have rotted in their non-official potting mixes.
And yet somehow nearly everything I've ever put to the soil came up. I don't know whether or not my plants are any better off now that I have gadgets to measure soil and air temp, and things to heat up root zones, and fans to cool and strengthen the starts - but I know *I* am sure more of a nervous wreck, LOL!