6,340 Garden Web Discussions | Growing from Seed
Need some clarification Jackie. Is this a cold frame or a greenhouse? Very different things. I will assume it is a GH since you mention "walking in.
If so then yes it is well past time in your zone to start seeds in a GH. HOWEVER some heat for it may be required on especially cold nights. Right now we are having to heat the GHs an average of 1-2 nights a week and that will continue here until about the 12th of April. And some method of cooling it will be required almost everyday now.
You have discovered one of the advantages/disadvantages of a GH - too hot in the day and too cold at night unless you have an insulated structure and learning how to balance the too is one of the primary challenges of GH growing. ;) The goal is to keep the air temps at plant height between 45 and 70 max. (65 is better)
So assuming you will be starting your seeds in containers and not in the ground as with a cold frame and assuming you will have a source of bottom heat to use for germination (soil temps of 70-85) then get a couple on min/max thermometers for monitoring your air temps and start planting your seeds.
Hope this helps.
Dave
PS: be sure to check out the Greenhouse forum here too.
Hi Jackie:
I assume you mean a greenhouse if you can walk into it and not a cold frame. A cold frame sits low to the ground and you can't walk into it. It would help if I could see a picture of it, but I'll go on the premise that it is actually a greenhouse. I have had a homemade greenhouse for many years and I think I can give you a few tips.
First make it as air tight as you can. Next is there any way you can section off a piece for seed starting. You don't need the whole greenhouse to start seeds and there's not much use heating the whole thing. A floor of stone or cement slabs or a combination of both will also help retain heat in the greenhouse. Often in old greenhouses you will see a brick or stone wall on the north side. That was not just decorative but also a way of heating the greenhouse at night.
There are 2 things I think You should consider buying. One is a minimum-maximum thermometer, and the other is a heater with a thermostat. The minimum-maximum thermometer gives you the lowest and highest temperatures since it was last set. This allows you to set the heater so it stays above freezing and lets you know when it's too hot and has to be opened. I live in zone 3. I open my greenhouse in mid Apirl. Our last freeze date is the end of May, so I would say you are just about right starting now. By the way I figured out it costs me around $50 for the season to heat my greenhouse with an Electric heater.
You have discovered the magic of a greenhouse. Yes it can be below freezing and if the sun is shining it will be too hot in the greenhouse. I try to keep mine in the 70's in the day, but at night it can go down to the low 40's.
If you don't want to heat at night, then have something you can cover your plants with when the thermometer dips very low at night. During greenhouse season I watch what the temperature is going to dip to every night. I do recommend you get the thermometer. It will be a great help with knowing what you have to do.
If you have any more questions post them and I'll be happy to answer if I can
If the seeds have started to sprout then the dome needs to be removed. There are several discussions here about that if you have the time to do a bit of reading.;) The domes are just for germination (and aren't really even needed for that), not for growing.
Sprouted seeds need light and air, not a dome. The increased air circulation will get rid of the mold. And moving them to the lights will help IF you don't over-water.
Dave
Most plants like to be planted at the relatively same depth as they grew in. That means they can go a bit lower but not much. Tomatoes planted deeper will grow roots along their stem but most plants don't do that and you run the danger of the stem rotting.
Do you have more than 1 light? Could you devote one light to your eggplant so you can have it higher than is needed for your other plants? If so I would stake your leggy plants and get them under the lights. Once they have enough light the stem will thicken
While increasing light will undoubtedly help, in my experience any plant in the Solancaea (sp?) family -- tomatoes, eggplants, peppers -- can be transplanted a bit deeper than the original soil line. Tomatoes are a bit more tolerant of this, but eggplants can also survive such a move.
oilpainter - elsewhere you noted that we have different climates so my sweet pea method wouldn't work for you. Now it's my turn to say the your lettuce technique doesn't work as well for me as starting them indoors:) The main reason is slugs and snails. If I sow outside a 10 foot row can be gone in a night at the 2 leaf stage. By starting indoors and then setting out transplants I can steal a march on the gastropods. In my cool damp climate lettuce is a cinch to transplant. I sow a small pinch of seed in each cell and then just pull the individual plants from the clumps and stuff them into the ground.
should I continue to use seed starting soil when I transplant and should I start fertilizing with a weak fish emulsion?
That's a bit of a gray, multi-opinionated area. Since you have done some reading you already know that I'm not big on supplemental feeding of young seedlings and consider it risky. Once they develop a second set of true leaves, fine as they will need some. But many others disagree with that position so it's up to you.
Basically it all depends on what soil mix you are using. If it is one that already has added nutrients then its fine. Since I use ProMix BX and it has some mircros in it I don't need to change. If not, then it's best to move on to a growing medium of some kind. Or if only doing a few plants then use your nutrient-free mix and feed them a diluted 1/2 strength feeding once a week or so.
Keep in mind that while fish emulsion is great for established plants in the garden, it isn't all that micro-nutrient inclusive or balanced when dealing with young seedlings (not mention it can stink up the house ;) so if that is what you prefer to use you might want to mix in some additional micros.
Bottom line as hoosiercherokee always says on the Tomato forum - watch your plants and they will tell you what they need. :)
Dave
I'm still very new to this seed starting, but last year I repotted 1/2 my tomatoes (I overplanted big time). The remaining ones I left in the 9-pack starting cells. What a difference. The ones I left in the 9-packs were stunted while the others really took off.
I just finished repotting my peppers, tomorrow the eggplants. I got smart this year and only started as many tomatoes as I needed plus 1 extra for each in 4" pots from the beginning.
Need to keep in mind that hardening off - what you are setting out to do - is a very gradual process. It is done in stages just like kids learning to walk. ;)
Direct sun exposure and wind are the primary enemies to young house-grown seedlings so their exposure for the first few days has to be limited and protected.
So as long as it is well above freezing, find a shaded or dappled sun location OUT OF THE WIND and give them an hour or 2 exposure with close monitoring. Next day if all goes well you can go to 2-4 hours, etc.
Experienced gardeners will tell you that once your plants are fully hardened off they shouldn't come back inside as it only sets them back once again. So most of us won't even start the process until a week or 10 days before they can go into the garden. How long until you will be able to plant these in the garden in your zone 3? Since zone 5 growers are just now setting out their cold- hardys I'm guessing a month or more for you, right?
Dave
Yep Dave. I'm in zone 3 and never plant anything outside intil the first of May. Our last frost day is the end of May so they say, but we usually get one the first week of June. That doesn't bother seeds under the soil, or things that a light frost would bother. Tender things however I plant in early June
I sowed a flower bed with a packet of Oriental Mix of Reds seeds outside in the Fall of 2008, and nothing came up at all the following spring of 2009. Having another packet of the same seeds, later that summer (2009), I sowed some of the seeds into a flower pot outside and they grew like crazy and I let the seeds ripen and fall into the pot. But nothing has happened with them so far this spring. Maybe it's still too cold yet.
As an experiment on March 7th 2010, I took a few of the remaining leftover seeds (still had some from last years packet) and put them in 4 pellet pots and put them under a grow light in my kitchen. On March 14th, I had sprouts! As of today they are small, but doing fine inside. I'm hoping they will bet big enough (1 set of true leaves) to be able to harden them off and plant them outside in 4-6 weeks.
I had no trouble with the shirley poppies, but the Oriental poppies seem to be fussier about their growing condtions. I hope this helps :))
Whether they "droop" or go into shock when transplanted depends on how old they are when transplanted and the steps or manner you use to do it. The younger they are the better they do. But even in the worst case they will often recover if given a few days of shade, minimal water and no feeding.
Dave
I winter sowed one in a plastic milk jug around the 1st of January. This one has sprouts.
I sowed three in cow pots, put inside a plastic bag and refrigerated for 3 weeks. They have been out of fridge and outside for about a month. One has sprouts and two doesn't.
These are all different kinds.
I ordered more seed last week. Since it isn't really cold outside anymore, I guess I'll try the fridge method with these when I get the seeds.
Yea, as long as they have not gotten wet/soaked by anything other than water, moldy, etc., you should still be able to use them. Just rememeber to remove that netting & pot up sooner than normal (as soon as root start to show on bottom of pellet) and you will be fine. =)
Great!!, then i will go ahead and use them. I had lots of them left over from last year and didn't want them to go to waste.
Dave thanks for the link, not sure why other people had problems. I have had great success with peat pellets. As soon as I see germination in the pellets, I put them under lights for 3-4 weeks and then transplant the plants (after removing all netting) into plastic cups filled with seed starter mix and leave them under lights , till I am ready to plant outside.
I'm currently growing abuliton.
I purchased seeds from Pinetree. 5 seeds for $1.95.
I sowed the seeds without soaking on January 14th in Jiffy Mix, just barely covering the seeds.I covered the container with a plastic bag and placed it in my fairly warm kitchen. I didn't use any bottom heat or supplemental lighting.
Four seeds sprouted within one week. I lost one seedling due to allowing the potting mix to dry out excessively.
I am now growing my three remaining seedling in yogurt cups in a west window that has light reducing glass. The seedlings are about 3" high and have 3-4 sets of true leaves. I'll probably start growing the plants under my shop lights soon and hopefully that will accelerate their growth.
Most abutilon that is sold through cataloges are hybrids so I don't know if that might of effected the viability of your collected seed.
slackermom, thanks for the answer. So it can be done, just not by me I guess! I have sown at least 50 seeds that I saved and the 10 that I purchased from Parks. Mine are in a flat with ProMix under a plastic dome. Doesn't sound much different than what you did. Guess I'll just have to try another batch. Thank you.
unless they were clones it could simply be genetic.
Tomatoes are a plant that will grow more roots along the stem if the stem is covered with more soil. It would kill most plants (esp seedlings), but tomatoes love it.
Sue