6,340 Garden Web Discussions | Growing from Seed
I get about 90% success by using a little trick:
Not sure where most people obtain this stuff, but I buy garden-grade vermiculite at our local feed store. Most people use it by incorporating it right into their soil mixtures.
I use an old parsley spice container with big holes (or perhaps an old parmesan cheese shaker would work). I drop the seed on the soil, and DON'T press in. Instead, I sprinkle vermiculite in a thin layer over the seeds. Then water very gently so as to disrupt the surface as little as possible. The vermiculite holds moisture right up next to the tiny seed while still allowing light in. It seems like such an unlikely simple solution...but I promise that it has helped survival rate of my baby sprouts so much!
My ice plant seeds seem to like high heat to germinate. About 75 to 80 degrees in 10-14 days. They grow surprisingly fast, and transplant very easily.
Another trick I employ in my efforts trying to grow tiny seeds: instead of watering with a regular pitcher I use a picnic ketchup bottle. It works perfect for squeezing the water onto the seedbed and/or tiny sprouts without dislodging them until they are big enough to handle the flow from the water pitcher.
Thanks for the thread, trying iceplant from seed for the first time this year. Looks like I'll have to give mine some supplemental heat to get started. I like to toss them in the oven with just the light on. It puts off a surprising amount of heat. I just have to remind the other half not to cook my seeds!
The seed packet will tell if they should be direct seeded or started indoors. And for those that should be direct seeded the standard instructions is "after all danger of frost is past" which usually means approx. 10-14 days after your last frost date.
On your list marigolds, portulaca, alyssum. sunflowers, zinnias, nasturtiums, and morning glory are normally direct seeded outdoors and work best that way. All the others can be done either way.
You might want to post over on the Annuals forum here and see if any of the growers there are in your region and can give you their experienced info on planting dates.
Dave
With respect .... but!!!! Why in the world would you cold stratify an hot area, jungle type plant? that is at home in Zone 11 Further - why soil temp of 55-60? Again - a heat loving plant where the soil temp is likely 80 +?
Scarify with file or sand paper or nick
Soak for 24 - 36 hours in warm water
Treat seed with fungicide
Barely cover seed
Keep soil moist
Maintain temp of 80 - 85 or so - use a heat mat
Fairly quick germination - 1 - 5 weeks
Fairly poor germination ~ 50 %
Do NOT stratify!
Have no idea who praxxus is but like some others, perhaps he just doesn't know any better. Which is odd as any experienced nursery grower knows and there is plenty of science-based info about it available on the web for the layman.
Dave
Hi.. thanks everyone for the feedback. I guess I will have to be more careful with the tranparent cups.
I had seen Ray (from the praxxus channel) do this but also thought that it was probably ok b/c soil blocks are an acceptable means of growing seedlings as well and in that the root are pretty open to air as well. I guess you keep those pretty close together and don't let it too much light.
It is simple enough for me to just place my cups in another opaque cup... so I may do that. Waste of cups but oh well you live and you learn.
its really not dependent on the seed once it sprouts yes it has energy stored in it for the seedlings to use that why some seeds sprout faster than other because some have more energy in them. that why when the first one sprouts on most of the bigger plant seeds you pluck the second or third out. Because that first one is the best and most vigorously bursting with energy therefore the winner.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden
The oldest mature seed that has grown into a viable plant was a Judean date palm seed about 2,000 years old, recovered from excavations at Herod the Great's palace on Masada in Israel. It was germinated in 2005.[4][5][6][7] Wiki
Still has a little pep, doesn't it?
I will be following this with interest, as broccoli seems to be the plant that I have the most trouble with in my zone 6.
Spinach and lettuce grow great. Tomatoes and peppers vary a lot year to year. Carrots and onions are so-so, but I often ignore them so I can't complain. But broccoli -- never got a single bite of anything in the four year I tried it in my 14 years of gardening.
Maybe I should treat it like spinach and plant it a number of different times to increase the chances of success.
Some followup questions now that my seedlings have really gotten big since I transplanted them into my 3.5 durapots. Another week or so and I will probably take them outside.
1) Is there a hardening process for broccoli?
2) Is the root system of broccoli very large? Will a 5 gallon grow bag be large enough?
3) For the 5-1-1 mix that I'll be using for the broccoli, after adding the dolomitic lime, would I use the same amount of Dynamite 15-5-9 CRF that I would for tomatoes?
4) Does broccoli need a lot of sun like tomatoes do?
5) Do I need to protect the broccoli from animals of any sort? If not, then I may not need to put the grow bags in my fenced in garden.
6) Should I dust with Bt as a preventative or only at the first signs of cabbage loopers?
Here's what the seedlings look now (inter-mixed with Dahlias):
Along with some pics of my new basement setup this year:
This post was edited by njitgrad on Tue, Mar 18, 14 at 13:32
Ah, and the peat pots retained a llooooot of water. thank you, this helped a lot and we've made adjustments. The ones we put in our drip tower are doing way better than the ones still in the peat pot.
haha, we bought what we found to be the best LED for our price range and it has done wonderfully!
Looks like a mixture of over watering and legginess to me. I would think LED would be fine for light. However, i have seen way more benifits personally to the gas lamps even though they cost more. I have seen 1000 times more dark green leafy growth under my HPS lights than my florescent or LED lights. Granted i have nothing against LED just think it has a little ways to go before its a wonder light for indoor plant growing. I would highly recommend spending a little more on power and on a 400watt hight pressure sodium or metal halide i think you will be amazed by the results.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden
This post was edited by Jonathan29 on Mon, Mar 17, 14 at 23:33
Jiffy Seed Starting Mix works fine and easy to hydrate if you do two simple things:
1) microwave distilled water to 130-140 degrees fahrenheit or max hand hot temperature. Using a liquid measuring pitcher place 1 quart of Jiffy SSM in a clean container like a one gallon zip lock bag. Then add 1 cup of hot water to the bag or container. Expel any excess air and zip bag up.
2) Using your hands grip and massage the bag. This step takes 2 minutes max.
You will now have hydrated Jiffy SSM.
Want to do a whole bag? Add 4 cups hand hot water. Wash and dry your hands and one arm up to elbow. Plunge hand and arm into mix and grip and squeeze Jiffy SSM. Be sure to get all of mix fully hydrated. Remove hand and arm and wash.
This step takes 5 minutes max.
You now have Jiffy SSM fully hydrated at the correct hydration. When you add the water to the mix it will seem like it is not enough but after 2-5 minutes of mixing you can squeeze a handful of the mix and just barely get a little water out.
I only use Jiffy SSM. I have had trouble with some of the other seed starting mixes ( Schul.. et al) over the years. I have not tried the other expensive mixes mentioned above. I go cheap. Works great.
I grow plants from seeds under lights most years 50+ flower varieties as well as some bushes and trees etc.
Rick
My suggestion to you is make you own mix from coco peat or called coir you can by a big block at a hyroponics store for 20$ then some vermiculite which is 20$ with about 5 gallons of compost or one bag of compost added. that alone will give you 2 20 gallon storage totes full of plant starting mix. more than enough for one season then maybe another if you recycle you soil a lot. It may seem like alot more money but per cubic foot of soil its much cheaper than a plant starting mix.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden
So peppers and tomatoes then. Everything else on your list is best direct seeded anyway.
Peppers are slow growing so those might work for them depending on how far in advance you start them. If you use the standard 8-10 weeks prior to transplanting to the garden and transplant them into the 3.5s when they are 2 weeks old they should hold until garden time.
But 4" pots would be better and the square pots always work better than the round ones as they fit in the standard trays. The round ones waste tray and shelf space..
Tomatoes need deep pots to go into. SVD 355 @5" deep work much better for them (or you can just use 16 oz. plastic drink cups like many do).
You can also find better prices than the site you linked. Several gh supply vendors sell regularly on ebay this time of year with big discounts on bulk orders and often free shipping. Novosel Enterprises.com also has better prices. Check them out.
Dave
For the tomatoes and peppers definitely need a square 1 gallon container when they get bigger like the size of mine that is just transplanted today into a 1 gallon pots. to keep them for the next week or two until i get my greenhouse that i ordered here. if you would like you can check out my youtube channel i am just starting out myself but have a lot of hort background from school. I don't have very many videos up yet but i will be adding how to's and such very soon over the course of a few months.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden
I think there is a FAQ about this on the Seed Saving forum (linked at the top of this forum's front page) but it really doesn't matter which you do as long as the seeds were never frozen. Frozen seeds should NOT be thawed first. With fridge storage it doesn't matter.
Dave
Just like Dave said. I really wont matter in fact i have found fridge storage then into a warm sunny place, or under grow light with a propagation mat. Actually makes them germinate faster than warming them up first.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden
While that makes sense, last year, both seedlings in a lot of the cells looked fabulous, and it was hard to choose which one to kill. I think for me, I'm more okay with having an empty cell than removing a perfectly healthy seedling to discard it. That is just me of course lol. As long as 1 to a cell is not detrimental to the plant somehow, I'm happy now that I chose the 1 per cell method. Thank you both so much for your answers.
I posted this under the seed starting thread as well.
Jiffy Seed Starting Mix works fine and easy to hydrate if you do two simple things:
1) microwave distilled water to 130-140 degrees fahrenheit or max hand hot temperature. Using a liquid measuring pitcher place 1 quart of Jiffy SSM in a clean container like a one gallon zip lock bag. Then add 1 cup of hot water to the bag or container. Expel any excess air and zip bag up.
2) Using your hands grip and massage the bag. This step takes 2 minutes max.
You will now have hydrated Jiffy SSM.
Want to do a whole bag? Add 4 cups hand hot water. Wash and dry your hands and one arm up to elbow. Plunge hand and arm into mix and grip and squeeze Jiffy SSM. Be sure to get all of mix fully hydrated. Remove hand and arm and wash.
This step takes 5 minutes max.
You now have Jiffy SSM fully hydrated at the correct hydration. When you add the water to the mix it will seem like it is not enough but after 2-5 minutes of mixing you can squeeze a handful of the mix and just barely get a little water out.
I only use Jiffy SSM. I have had trouble with some of the other seed starting mixes ( Schul.. et al) over the years. I have not tried the other expensive mixes mentioned above. I go cheap. Works great.
I grow plants from seeds under lights most years 50+ flower varieties as well as some bushes and trees etc.
Rick
In fairness to Jiffy Mix, I have used it for years and have never had a problem. I search it out over other brands. I Use the deep woods method described in the previous post. Just pour in some hot water and mix. Don't even measure, just guesstimate. Jiffy Mix and Pro Mix for potting up have been my favorites. I direct seed most flowers and veggies but use the two mentioned for starting peppers, tomatoes, leeks and some flowers. Dried out peat will repel moisture. That's why it is not recommended for a mulch. Good Luck.
First let me say there is a FAQ here about this question as well as many discussions about it the search will pull up for you.
Feeding seedlings is a very debated topic, some do, many don't. Lots of variables to consider. The primary one being what nutrients are in your growing mix? You'll have to check the label for that info. If it contains added nutrients then nothing else is usually needed.
Another variable is how long the plants have to go until transplanted out to the garden. If tomatoes were started at the usual 6-8 weeks before transplanting nothing may be needed. But if they have to sit around for 10-12 weeks before transplanting they will need feeding.
There is no "what most use" fertilizer. There are 100's of choices and the choice is yours. While the plants are in containers most organic fertilizers will not work as there is no active soil food web to convert them to a useable form so liquid synthetics are used. If you feel you must use an organic only then one of the many fish emulsion/kelp blends or some sort of compost tea or worm tea are really your only good choices. And yes, they do smell. That is the nature of organic fertilizers.
But if you do choose to feed them then wait until AFTER they have developed at least their first set of true leaves, use a liquid not a granular form, and dilute it to no stronger than 1/2 strength (many use 1/4 strength). Just as you wouldn't feed a newborn baby adult portions or steak and potatoes, the same holds true for seedlings. :)
Dave
So i start fertilizing at half or little under half strength as soon as i see true leaves forming. and i water with a diluted to 50% mixture every watering i have gotten awesome results. not for fertilizer i use a Organic Doctor earth fertilizer for veggies. Then i also use a liquid fertilizer called florolicious plus it is made of organic fermented beet juice and kelp. it is very mild on stinkiness when you delude it to 2- 2 and 1/2 teaspoons on one gallon of water. really has not smell. I have some videos on my youtube channel where i show these i need to still make a video on mixing fertilizer's. but i will do that in do time hopefully soon.
Here is a link that might be useful: TheItalian Garden