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Expectations v/s Patience!

Posted by MrsG47 7 RI (My Page) on
Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 15:54

Once you are hooked on this fabulous sport, it is hard to play anything else. I look at each and every tree, every blossom and every piece of fruit. We (my trees and I) are very good friends. I walk around my orchard explain in far too much detail the year the variety was discovered or hybrid and from which country. My husband listens with incredible patience, far more than I have! I look at my four year old Euro combo pear and the thing is empty. Not a sign of a pear anywhere. I have two Mirabelles fruiting but not the third mirabelle. The Bavay gage arrived as a whip and has been in the ground for three years. . . nada. It finally took eight years for my Italian plums to have a crop. My apples, well you know about my apples. . . The peaches are coming along. The three new apricots going in this year and last, will not give any fruit for at least four years. I tell my friends, 'this should be an excellent fruit year'. . . I am going to stop saying anything until I have buckets of fruit! Thirty trees and not much to show for it. I do know that in a year or two I probably will have that incredible year where I'll be sitting in the orchard laughing my a__ off surrounded by fruit. Until then,I just have to wait. Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

I'm still waiting on peaches. But the small fruit keeps me busy daily. It takes about an hour to harvest my strawberries every morning. The raspberries are loaded, like tens of pounds of them. Maybe 2000 or more. The currants are doing great, as are the blueberries, which I will harvest all summer till September. Nice to have them that ripen at different times. Also the raspberries and strawberries will provide fruit daily till November. I must say a lot more gratifying that fruit trees. At least so far. I do harvest cherries each year, and that's always nice too. Soon will forage for wild raspberries, blackberries, and mulberries. I really like mulberries, one tree near my cottage has exceptional fruit.
Here's yesterday's harvest, I get this many daily. The freezer will be jammed with various fruit by September.
 photo harvest001.jpg


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 18:20

I here ya MrsG! I have our hobby farm planted with everything and anything that will grow.We seem to have really good luck with apples , grapes,kolomikta kiwi and all the various small berries. Stone fruits are quite challenging, we had a really harsh winter so no peaches this year.On the other hand like you I am patiently waiting for my Italian plum to give me a single plum.Planted in 2008, it is getting really big about 16 feet tall and about a 5 inch caliper if not bigger. For the past 3 years it has bloomed but not set any fruit, this it it was absolutely loaded with flowers and seems it may hang on to a lot of the fruit this time around:) I will keep you posted;)
Like Drew51 I let the berries fill in the void of not so much tree fruit HAHAHA. here is a pic of my haskap patch.I have several varieties, indigo gem, indigo treat, tundra,borealis, Cinderella and a pollinator of unknown variety. Really cold start this year last 2 year they were pretty much done at this time and strawberries are staring to turn red......this year haskaps just starting to turn color and strawberries are still in bloom with a few tiny green berries! I have never seen such a late year before.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 18:21

here is a close up of Indigo gem or treat...sorry I can't remember which one it is LOL!


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Awesome on the haskap! Cool! I have three plants, but they are at my cottage, it's a hard environment, no fruit this year. Still rather young. I'm not sure if they wiill work in that environment, but they survived the winter, so that's good! No much sun, hoping they fruit anyway.
I do have some blue fruit though! Blueberries! This cultivar differs from my others in that the blueberries are blue from the start not green, like my other plants.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew, what variety is the one in the picture that starts and stays blue? Do you have a problem with birds eating them early?


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 20:40

that is an interesting blue berry variety, what is it? The haskaps are great,Had a hard frost the end of May while they were in full bloom.The plants were totally white when I got up in the morning. It went down to minus 2C(28F) that night and didn't fizzy them one bit.


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The birds don't know what blueberries are around here, so they don't bother them. I suspect that will end. The same was true for strawberries. This year the robins figured out they were edible. Nobody grows blueberries here, generations of local birds never seen them. No wild types around here either. So please keep it down, mums the word! Actually since I grow strawberries around them, and the birds started eating the strawberries, the plants are now netted. At one point I got Toro and Liberty mixed up, pretty sure this one is Toro. Although not 100% positive. My dog mangled the plant to one stick! About a year ago. It recovered somehow? Still rather small, a slow grower too. It becomes a deeper blue when ripe. So you can still tell. Relates to the topic. I was set back a year waiting for fruit because of the dog. Man was I mad at him! He has never touched another plant. Smart dog :)

This post was edited by Drew51 on Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 21:24


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

So true in the fruit business! In no time MrsG,.. you'll be loaded!
The first 10 years are tough!


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MrsG, I can sure relate to you post. My orchard is my playground and my sanctuary; visions of sugar-plums dance in my head. Although I have thought that if I had taken up boating I might have saved quite a bit compared to my orchard.

While I peruse my orchard I often think of the plant breeders who have left me this legacy. There would be no way to calculate the decades and centuries some of my prized fruits have been improved upon by men and women who had a similar passion.

As far as my harvest this year, that would be one single tiny little strawberry from the starts I received from NCGR last fall.


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  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Fri, Jun 20, 14 at 6:53

" Although I have thought that if I had taken up boating I might have saved quite a bit compared to my orchard"

Having done both, you are incorrect. Boating is the most expensive hobby I have ever done. Gardening is a money pit, boating is a black hole of expenses! I now only own a 9 foot aluminum. All I can afford, and I need a new motor!


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MrsG47. What you wrote was very thought provoking for me. I’m an older guy now but when I was a student at Auburn University a historic agriculture and engineering school I did not choose where my heart was as a major. While studying in the library I would find myself drifting over to the large volume of books about fruit growing. I have been hooked ever since those days on the plains. Thanks, Bill


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Hi all. There is no question the reward is there, I know it is as I tasted it for the first time four years ago with the bite of my first homegrown peach.
What is amazing it the beauty of it all, and the centuries, not years of some of my heirloom apples. My new Calville Blanc d'Hiver apples leave me in awe. The history of the apple alone is amazing. If Monet can paint them, so can I and eat them as well.
I look at the shapes of the trees, the bark, the leaves and of course the flowers. They are all different. I am in my mid sixties and I put in five new trees this past spring? Hmmmm, sure hope I'll see fruit from those trees in five years!
Milehigh, it is my sanctuary. I don't hide there, I live there. Mrs. G


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I am in my mid sixties and I put in five new trees this past spring?

My dad is in love with American elms and for his 70th birthday I bought him dutch elm disease resistant trees. I kind of thought I was crazy until he told me a quote from Martin Luther:

"Even if I knew that tomorrow the world would go to pieces, I would still plant my apple tree."

"God writes the Gospel not in the Bible alone, but also on trees, and in the flowers and clouds and stars."

Martin Luther


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  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sat, Jun 21, 14 at 1:13

Wow, those last posts were rather heavy, back to simple stuff. Hey I noticed that my Toro blueberry berries turn green, after starting blue, They only produced last year for the first time, so i didn't notice it. Now looking more like the others. Notice how green those leaves are! The plant is happy! Still some blue in there...
 photo 006-5.jpg


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Anticipation and even frustration of crop loss is what gives the harvest its real meaning to me. It was funny how last year the stars aligned here almost completely- nearly perfect weather and an absolute crash of the squirrel population that is only now beginning to recover. Low insect pressure as well.

The crop was so bountiful and kept coming for so long that it actually decreased the value of the experience in a way- it's like when I lived in S. CA and when you've received the 90th day of perfect weather it's not nearly as thrilling as that perfect day in the northeast after 3 consecutive rainy grey days. Also, preserving and distributing all the surplus became real work.

Because I can't count on my customers to put up with having to wait too long for what they want, I do concentrate on starting with a few varieties in their orchard that are most likely to produce well instead of going just for the most amazing flavored stuff every time. But these people, who generally are used to getting whatever they want when they want it, often become addicted to the anticipation and value of something they actually have to wait for. (Meanwhile they can have tree ripened fruit Fedexed to them from exclusive orchards in CA.)

I made the mistake when I started here of trying to duplicate the varieties that I loved to eat in younger days in S. CA. Many things I first tried didn't do well here- I was also tricked my misleading catalogs that claimed a wider range of survivability, zone-wise, than reality confirmed- and provided no guidance on the likelihood of fruiting here even after survival.

I think the best strategy is to have a core of relatively reliable varieties before branching out to less likely candidates. It is also smart, as several already pointed out, to include brambles and other quick to yield fruits.

Here, peaches and J. plums are generally reliable and early to yield as well, but it does depend on the varieties. There is such a range of performance between varieties of all species, actually, and then the question of roostocks.


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H-man, part of my addiction to fruit trees is your fault! LOL A little encouragement goes a long way with me! Mrs. G


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  • Posted by chills Zone 6b Mi (My Page) on
    Sat, Jun 21, 14 at 19:21

DREW51. Im jealous, ive basically given up on growing blueberries here. The serviceberriew more than make up for them. Ive got 1 left and 3 which the bunnies atr to the ground, from 4+ feet this winter. From the four I probably got a pint, total, last summer.

Wheee in the SE Mitten are ?

Chills


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  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sat, Jun 21, 14 at 20:19

Sterling Heights. 8 miles north of Detroit. 8 miles from 8 mile! When I move i suspect I will have similar problems. My backyard is sheltered from all. Nobody grows any gardens here, so the pest pressure is near zero. If I could I would stay right here! Unless I win the lotto, I'm moving.


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  • Posted by olpea zone 6 KS (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 9:44

It was written:

"Once you are hooked on this fabulous sport, it is hard to play anything else. I look at each and every tree, every blossom and every piece of fruit."

My response:

Anything worth doing is worth overdoing :-)


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  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 10:45

This was posted yesterday on TV. Mary is very cool, sharing seeds, and recipes. She was growing 150 different peppers this year. many she collected herself from markets in Spain, India, Australia etc. Many cultivars are not for sale anywhere around here. She was going to offer seeds this fall. Anyway she posted this yesterday



We had been gone for about three weeks and returned home to Mexico for a short 10 days before leaving for Denmark. We decided to take our boat out for a day of fishing and left about 6 am and returned about 5 pm.
As we approached our home outside of Merida, We noticed that there appeared to be a crowd at our front gate. I said to my Husband “Gee, I hope the house is not on fire…”
As we stopped and exited our Jeep, you could have heard a flea hiccup. Absolute silence save for one gentleman wringing his hat and with tears running down his face. For the life of me, I could not figure out what was going on.

Speaking Spanish at mach one speed, the man kept saying “I am so sorry Senora. I will pay. Please don’t call the police’.

Long story kind of short…The man owns 2 bulls that he rents out to local cow owners for breeding. It seems his son failed to lock the gate when he brought the bulls in from pasture. They moseyed down the road about a mile to my house. Behind our place, there is a man with 6 cows. We have a great fence but these two lothario’s tore it to smithereens, & crunched it down in pursuit of female companionship. After gaining access to our property, they put love on the back burner and decided that they had landed in bovine food heaven. Isn’t that the way? Always boils down to food or sex…

We had nearly 5,000 plants that were all just about to hit peak production. Melons, squash, pumpkins, peppers, tomatoes, you name it. Picture in your mind if you will what a large garden would look like if you drove a riding lawn mower over it, dragging a log, a tiller and a big rock…They ate, they sampled, they pulled plants out of the ground, they pooped and peed all over everything, they laid down and rolled on it, they tromped on just about everything with those nice big cloven hooves. After a nosh and a nap, they continued on to the neighbor behind me and tore down that fence and commenced to “do what bulls do with cows”.

There is very little worth saving. I told our Handyman to bring in his family and neighbors and take anything they think is worth salvaging. I can’t even save seed because everything is all mixed up and I have no idea what is what (I could guess on some but won’t do that…) It is too late in the year to start over. We travel from August to December so a new garden is out of the question. I did reassure the poor man that owns the bulls that I would not be calling the police and we wanted no money. Apparently, if bulls get out, it is a very steep fine due to the fact that bulls are well, dangerous…

I’d cry, but really, we got to laughing. Who could ever imagine something like this would happen? It really does look like a “Vegetable Apocalypse “ It is truly the worst garden debacle of my life and one that assaults my manic, anal compulsion of order.
And as a hilarious side note, the buggers did not touch the tomatillos, cilantro and dill which they could have wiped out and I would barely have raised an eyebrow (those plants grow in a far off corner in crappy dirt, full sun for 16 hours and are basically ignored yet they thrive…)

So whatever your garden woes are, believe me, I think I would have been glad to trade. 2014…the Year of the Bull at Mary’s house in Mexico! I am a vegetarian but am contemplating eating beef once more and with gusto!

Mary is one of the coolest people I have ever met online. She knows equipment, techniques, can grow and cook anything better than most of us. She has saved me countless hours of time. Her recipes are the best I have ever seen. How to can stuff, how to make sauce, what equpment to use, wow, a wealth of knowledge!
As I said she is growing 150 peppers, and knows how to make about 150 different pepper sauces. What each pepper is used for how it is prepared in each country of origin. And she is a tomato expert also. Bringing back seed from the far corners of the earth to share with us all. For free! I'm growing seed from her this year.

This post was edited by Drew51 on Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 10:53


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

In one way, it seems like Mary is a gardener in the same sense as my customers. I don't think true gardeners travel much during the growing season. Wonder how much of her gardening is done with Mary's hands.

Not that I don't feel some envy for her jetsetter's mobility, but if I had millions in the bank I would still be around my orchard most of the growing season. The only time the deer jump my fence to my veg garden is when I'm out of town for a weekend.

There's just nothing I enjoy more than walking through my orchard and watching my balls grow. OK, make that orbs.

By the way, love the idea of calling orcharding a "sport".


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 11:45

Some more from Mary


I wish it was a story...The day after, I got up in the morning and as is my want, I take my coffee press and a few newspapers up to my rooftop patio where I have a spectacular view. I looked out from the roof and thought OMG...Armageddon! My Husband is still in shock I think...he lost so much more than I. Well, for once I won't be busting my butt in the canning kitchen as well as drying seeds/tomatoes. Dang...I have done it ever year for most of my life and have no idea what I will do...

I also forgot to mention the destruction the bulls caused to our irrigation system...They broke off several sprinkler heads and actually bent one metal pipe faucet over (scratching their worthless bull behinds no doubt or their giant sized heads!) They had to have been in their for 5-6 hours before anyone noticed they were missing. My neighbors have all been by to commiserate with us but are probably pitying themselves as well as we give everyone in the neighborhood produce and they just watched their share vanish!

You know, I used to feel bad when we "collected" the bulls semen for testing (okay, without getting to graphic, "Hot Prod" up butt, shock, out comes semen and I apologize in advance if I have offended anyone's sensibilities and most of you could have gone a lifetime without knowing how we did that...) I would feel a lot less bad doing it now!!!

Mary is well known for her sun dried tomatoes, having a large cliental of gourmet restaurants. She also sells dried peppers.
She was raised in New Mexico (I think? maybe Montana?) on a ranch. Her dad was a big rancher.
Her brother is also a grower in the states, so she should have some product to work with. I think she is retired now. Winding down her business. Well a good year to do just that! She gives away to the local community living in Mexico, and not in gringoland, but in real Mexico.
Although it must be nice near the ocean, she has mentioned the excellent fish market in town.

This post was edited by Drew51 on Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 11:57


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew,

"many she collected herself from markets in Spain, India, Australia etc".

Do you know how Mary collect those seeds legally? Or Mexican govt is not as strict as the US? I am very tempted to collect veggie seeds from places I've visited but never dare due to strict US custom laws.


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  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 12:27

"Do you know how Mary collect those seeds legally"

Probably not!
Here is her list of peppers she had growing
1. Cayenne (Bulgaria)
2. Cayenne Arzeta (Indonesia)
3. Cayenne Azgri (India)
4. Cayenne Baelae (China)
5. Cayenne Byadagi (India)
6. Cayenne Corbaci (Turkey)
7. Cayenne de Espania
8. Cayenne de Italia
9. Cayenne Gigante (Bolivia)
10. Cayenne Golden
11. Cayenne Guinea Spice (Malta)
12. Cayenne Impala
13. Cayenne Inchanga (South Africa)
14. Cayenne Joes Long (by way of Italy to Montreal to Joe Sesito to Carolyn to Johnny's Seeds.)
15. Cayenne Keriting (Indonesia)
16. Cayenne Kopay (Indonesia)
17. Cayenne Laris (Indonesia)
18. Cayenne Long, thick, Hot (Guiana)
19. Cayenne Long, Thin, Hot (Guiana)
20. Cayenne Maules Red
21. Cayenne Monstruo Rojo Guatemala
22. Cayenne NuMex Las Cruces
23. Cayenne Paramas Indonesia
24. Cayenne Portugal
25. Cayenne Ring Of Fire
26. Cayenne Ristra (Mexico)
27. Cayenne Sujata (India)
28. Cayenne Supremo (Colombia)
29. Cayenne Type Bangladeshi
30. Cayenne Type Kashmiri Mirch (India)
31. Cayenne Type Mesilla
32. Cayenne Type Mombasa (Uganda)
33. Cayenne Uyababa (South Africa)
34. Cayenne Type Lama Panas Merah (Malaysia)
35. Medium Aji Brown (Peru)
36. Medium Bonda Ma Jacques (Lesser Antilles)
37. Medium Cabe Rawit Indonesia
38. Medium Cajamarca (Peru)
39. Medium Catarina (Spain)
40. Medium Habanero Chocolate
41. Medium Habanero Red
42. Medium Habanero White Grande
43. Medium HabaneroYellow
44. Medium Habenero Orange
45. Medium India Naga Jalokia
46. Medium Jalapeno
47. Medium Jalapeno Purple
48. Medium Jalapeno Serrano
49. Medium Zambia (Zambia Africa)
50. Mega 7 Pod Primo (T&T)
51. Mega 7 Pod White (T&T)
52. Mega 7 Pot Brain Strain (T&T)
53. Mega 7 Pot Brain Strain Yellow (T&T)
54. Mega Aji Pacae (Peru)
55. Mega Aji Panca (Peru)
56. Mega Assam Bih Julokia (India)
57. Mega Bahamian Starfish (Bahamas)
58. Mega Bhut Jalokia Ghost
59. Mega Bhut Jalokia Peach
60. Mega Black Naga (Bangladesh)
61. Mega Caramel Bhut
62. Mega Carolina Reaper
63. Mega Donni Sali (Guam)
64. Mega Jamaica Red
65. Mega Jamaica Yellow
66. Mega Jays Peach
67. Mega Moruga Scorpion Brown (T&T)
68. Mega Moruga Scorpion Red (T&T)
69. Mega Sunrise Scorpion (T&T)
70. Mega Tabia (Bali)
71. Mega Tasmanian (Naga Land India)
72. NuMex 64L
73. NuMex Barker
74. NuMex Big Jim
75. NuMex Big Jim Legacy
76. NuMex Conquistador
77. NuMex Eclipse
78. NuMex Espanola
79. NuMex Joe E. Parker
80. NuMex Lumbre XX
81. NuMex Mesa
82. NuMex Pueblo
83. NuMex RNaky
84. NuMex Sandia
85. NuMex Sunset
86. NuMex Type Anaheim
87. NuMex Type Conchiti New Mexico
88. NuMex Type Cow Horn
89. NuMex Type Giant Red Argentina
90. NuMex Type Guajillo
91. NuMex Type Hatch Green
92. NuMex Type Hatch Red
93. NuMex Type Isleta
94. NuMex Type Isleta Long
95. NuMex Type Sonora
96. NuMex Type Sonora
97. NuMex Type Spanish Spice
98. Ornamental Medusa (wreaths)
99. P Chimayo (NM Native)
100. P Greek Stavros Hot
101. P Hades
102. P Inferno
103. P Jemez (Jemez Pueblo New Mexico)
104. P Mariachi
105. P Pepperoncini Italian Hot (Italy)
106. P Rio Grande (New Mexico)
107. P Santa Fe Grande (Guerro New Mexico)
108. P Volcano
109. Spain Black Hot (Spain)
110. Spain Choricero (Basque)
111. Spain Paprika Extremeno
112. Spain Piment d'Espelette (Basque)
113. Spain Pimente Negro Picante
114. Specialty Ancho Gigantea
115. Specialty Ancho Mulato Isleno
116. Specialty Bahklouti (Tunisia)
117. Specialty Broome Chili (Australia)
118. Specialty Cajun Belle
119. Specialty Fajita Belle
120. Specialty Negro De Valle (Mexico)
121. Specialty Orchid (Brazil)
122. Specialty Pasilla Apaseo (Mex)
123. Specialty Pasilla Bajio (Mexico)
124. Specialty Pasilla de Oaxaca (Mexico)
125. Specialty Rocoto Mexican
126. Specialty Tabasco (Original Louisiana Strain)
127. Specialty Vietnam Ot Heim (HanoiRed)
128. Specialty Vietnam Semillas
129. Sweet Aji Dedo De Mocha (Brazil)
130. Sweet Big Bertha
131. Sweet Big Bulgarian (Bulgaria)
132. Sweet Big Daddy
133. Sweet Colossal
134. Sweet Criolla De Cocina (Nicaragua)
135. Sweet Elephant Ears (Serbia)
136. Sweet Giant (Paraguay)
137. Sweet Giant Marconi (Italy)
138. Sweet Giant Red Bell
139. Sweet Jupiter
140. Sweet Maraca
141. Sweet Minis
142. Sweet Nora De Espania (Spain)
143. Sweet Pequillo (Spain)
144. Sweet Purple Marconi (Italy)
145. Sweet Red Marconi (Italy)
146. Sweet Romanian (Romania)
147. Sweet Tequila
148. Sweet Trinidad Perfume (T&T)
149. Sweet Yellow
150. Sweet Yellow Marconi (Italy)


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 12:39

Many of these peppers you can get elsewhere, but a few are rare. i wanted
Mega Bahamian Starfish (Bahamas)
and some of the paprika type peppers, the Spanish and Basque peppers she collected. i wanted some of those. oh well she will offer them next year. Not like I don't have any. I'm growing a couple rare ones myself.

Aleppo-(Capsicum annuum)-The Aleppo is a rare chile from the region of
Northern Syria and Southern Turkey. Also called the Halaby pepper.
There are a few peppers named Aleppo one is a Cayenne type. This is the
more rare Pimento type also known as Aleppo 36. My seeds were obtained
from an Italian Horticulturist and researcher who got his seeds many years
ago from one of the USDA seed banks. We have grown this variety out two
cycles in 2013 to strengthen the purity of the variety before selling seeds.
The Aleppo pepper is named after the famous city of Aleppo that is on
the famous silk road that was used to trade spices and goods as early as
200 B.C. it ran from North Africa though Arabia, Persia, Turkey and
China. Aleppo peppers have a sweet taste with a nice kick of heat on
the back end. In the markets in Istanbul the Aleppo powders are sold for
twice the amount of other similar peppers. Many sellers can be found on
the web selling Aleppo pepper powder or flakes. Most of it is adulterated
with cheaper peppers like Cayenne. Culinary experts and Chefs agree it is
hard to find real pure Aleppo powder. The amazing discovery I made in
2013 is this pepper is so delicious fresh! In my opinion they are one of
the most delicious peppers on earth. My friend Timothy Bader of Volcanic
Peppers is the first to make a commercial sauce in America with this
pepper. Aleppo plants can grow over four feet tall and peppers ripen from
green to dark red.

Criolla De Cocina Pepper - I first received seed for this great pepper
15 years ago, so I am so excited to get it into the catalog! This small
pepper was collected in 1988 in Nicaragua from a farmer. It produces
small 4" peppers that are fragrant and richly flavored; these have
strong pepper flavor making them perfect for a variety of dishes.
Fruit is green turning to red as they ripen.

Pimenta de Neyde Pepper - (Capsicum x) An extremely rare pepper
originally from Brazil with dark purple fruits and beautiful, colored
foliage. The hot fruits grow to a couple of inches and remain dark
purple-almost black for much of their ripening period. When ripe,
fruits change color subtly, with a neon purple tint. A gorgeous plant
to grow, with spicy edible fruits! Believed to be a cross between C.
annuum and chinense

Venezuelan Tiger Pepper - Venezuelan Tiger-(Capsicum chinense)-This is a
very rare pepper. How rare?? My friend from the U.K. Chris obtained the
seeds in 2012 from his friend's grandmothers backyard in Venezuela. So
really as of 2013 nobody has these. The Venezuelan Tiger peppers can get
up to the size of a small hand grenade. They ripen from light green to
bright red. They have a mild heat level and are extremely sweet.
They are ideal for making a sweet Asian style sauce. The Venezuelan
Tiger chile pepper plants can reach almost 4 feet in height

This post was edited by Drew51 on Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 14:04


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew, most don't know here what a consumate collector you are. I can see why you have so much respect for Mary. So where does her money come from, if I may ask?


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 22, 14 at 14:28

I have a bad habit of collecting, we talked about my concert tapes. it seems in my nature I guess? I don't know her that well. I know via her posts. Even the seeds from her, are actually through another. I have talked to her via email, she was helping me find seeds and connected me up with a company in Africa. "Seeds For Africa" Anyway she never really said, and I don't know her well enough to ask.
Notice how well written her message is. I know one of her brothers is a photographer for Reuters and also travels the world.
I have thought about living in Mexico, it's cheap, you can live full on 2 grand a month. I still may! Looking at Belize too. I'm not staying here many more winters. I can grow tropical fruit there, it sounds really good to me. You can visit me! "-] Belize was a former British colony, they all speak the Queen's English, much like Jamaica. I would much rather live in Jamaica, but it's not cheap, Belize is cheap! I've been to Jamaica 4 times. I want to check out Belize next winter, stay 10 days. They give Americans tax breaks to live there, you have to have a proven income. Woman run everything there, for whatever reason the population is mostly woman. Sure some risk living in all these places, but hey I live in the Detroit area, I face risk daily! My wife works in Detroit, we live in the suburbs 8 miles away. I'm totally a city boy! I know how to handle myself, access risk, etc. Only way to survive here. Baghdad is safer. Well until recently.(actually it was, more murders in Detroit). So a move to these places in all likelihood would be a step up!


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Since you asked..."Her Money" comes from being a veterinarian for 40 years, raising beef cattle and running an equine breeding business for the cutting horse industry. "She" is not a millionaire, she just worked damn hard and saved her money.

And yes, "She" does most of the work for the peppers and tomatoes she grows. She starts all seedlings in her greenhouse, she transplants them all and she cares for them. Her garden is finished by end of July so she is free to travel without appearing to be "gallivanting" all over the world while someone else does all the work.

Her husband grows everything else very nearly by himself except for harvesting when our handyman and his oldest boy help so that the stuff can get picked fast and be on it's way. "She" does not eat meat or vegetables or fruit...ever. Almost all of the produce grown goes to the catholic church which distributes it all over, especially to the poor who live in areas of Mexico where the climate sucks, there is lack of water, etc.

Do I have a permit for seeds? No...we all trade seeds all over the world. The officials would have a hell of a time rounding us all up. I DO NOT bring back whole fruits, nuts or vegetables (that damn "fruit sniffing" dog would get me in a heart beat...) I do however purchase a permit for the orchards I bring back. Any more questions? I resent being thought a lazy dilettante who takes all the credit and does nothing. And by the way, I am 62, have had systemic Lupus for 34 years, have half one hand paralyzed due to an accident and have had the crap beat out of me by bulls, cows and horses MY ENTIRE LIFE. And yet, I garden, do all the work myself...go figure.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Sun, Nov 2, 14 at 20:55

Mary,

Awesome, hope you don't mind me copying your posts. it was out of respect, and I didn't ask those questions. Thanks for sharing, you have inspired me, and feel you are a mentor. I'm in awe of what you've done and tried to present it that way. My apologies if I offended you, or failed to show you respect.
Very cool a veterinarian, I thought of becoming one at one time, but soon figured out that it would be easier to become a doctor. Well in the sense of getting in. The bar is set higher for vets. I went to MSU, it is the only university in MI with a college of Veterinary Medicine. I didn't have the smarts to be any doctor (let alone Vet), but graduated from the College of Human Medicine at MSU in Medical Technology. I got to work with a lot of the material the Vet school had available. Slides of whole mouse kidneys, stuff like that. I received a decent education there because of it. I no longer work in the field. Pretty much retired now.
Anyway welcome to this forum, despite the first impression, lot's of decent people here. Hope all is well.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Brokenbar! Welcome to the forum. What a fabulous amount of information. Thanks you. Gardener's do, do all of the work, don't they. Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew, wasn't you! I sometimes wonder why I do all the work myself! I just love it I guess. Have to admit the bull debacle just plain sucked...all that work...However, we are looking forward to next year already (gardeners...eternal optimists!) Husband keeps saying he "feels the clock ticking away" (Mary shakes her head...) He says he won't be planting as much this year but we will see. I got some new varieties from Spain (shhhhh....don't tell the seed Nazi's...) I lost a lot of peppers that I don't have seeds left for. I am currently going through what I have. Sorry to hijack this particular thread with talk about peppers. I came across it by accident. Millionaire...I WISH! (then I would have 50 greenhouses....) Heading to Bolivia and going to stay about a month. New archeological site...
Anyway, I am glad you are doing good Drew and I will let you know what I end up with for seed pepper-wise. Mary the rich, lazy, gallivanting international seed smuggler.HAHAHAHAHA


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 4, 14 at 18:53

I must admit I enjoy your posts, I don't belly laugh that often! Ask at the TV site for seed, and no doubt all will be recovered. Recently that happened with a user whom lost his tomato seeds. I have some too, and will help if I can.
Well I'm about to send some brambles to Canada, well actually dried flowers, my bad..
.;-)
Mary not your cup of tea, but today i was offered a black raspberry from a breeder whom is retiring. Very kind, and one of a kind stuff, I'm very exicited about it.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Oops, sorry Mary for jumping to conclusions- had you confused for something else.

I did some work for a woman years ago who is famous for collecting exotic melons from all over the world and "growing" them on her estate. She's an heiress who gives generously to and sits on the board of one of the largest botanical gardens in the country. She knows less about gardening than many of my neighbors but is generally recognized as expert because she wants to be- and she does oversee the growth of a lot of different kinds of melons, writes books about it but actually has very little intellectual interest in gardening itself and less in actually getting dirty.

Then there is another gardening "overseer", the infamous M S, the media diva of American gardening, who fairly recently wasted a half of my day to pump my brain pretending to be searching for someone to manage her extended orchard.

The next day she met with the foreman of the crew of the corporate tree care company (he's a friend of mine, by coincidence) who does the job for free in exchange for her promotional help. She explained the finer points of what I had foolishly given her. She paid me with a dozen eggs from her free range chickens, said she'd hire me and allowed me to show up on the property so her armed guard could tell me there's been a change of plans. There was no actual change in plans

I'd been had- and I only showed up because I was hoping for some help in promoting my bearing age fruit tree nursery- didn't need the maintenance work because my docket is full. Conned out of a decent consultation fee by one of the worlds richest. Found out later this is her favorite sport. She'd rather win at it than actually get the best work done with true allies.

Sorry for confusing you with a different type, but I didn't expect it to go beyond Drew and this little group. I really don't see how you can leave your garden for extended periods during the growing season because I've never known a serious gardener who would. The whole point for me is nurturing the plants through all the trials and tribulations of childhood and to the fulfillment of their mature potential.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 4, 14 at 20:50

Well currently no garden exists thanks to a couple of bulls!
I must admit the garden kicked my butt good this year. It was a lot of work. Still is. A massive cleanup of dead plants! In a way I'm ready for a break! Although the urgency is gone, no need to hurry up and remove dead things, so the pace is a lot better. No spraying, at least not yet, and no small harvest window. I enjoyed my homemade tomato sauce tonight, and my peppers! One more batch of tomato sauce to make. Then some jam, but on my schedule, much easier!
I have many peppers, and next week I'm going to try my first attempt at Rocoto Relleno, see how it goes. Found all I need today at the store.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

I had to leave my garden in growing season due to a couple of things...We had to fly to Houston for some medical tests my Husband needed. Then we were home for 10 days and had to fly off to a wedding of his best friend and were only gone 5 days. We have an automated watering system and Our neighbor and caretaker kept an eye on everything. Usually, other than going fishing for a day (And it's not a yacht or even a cabin cruiser, it's a fishing boat...) we are never gone from December, when I start my plants until about the first or 2nd week in August, (factoring in how ever long it takes me to can marinara, salsa and dry about 500 lbs of tomatoes...)

Had I not been a vet, I would have been an archeologist, (which is my passion) and we travel to little known sites throughout the world...hardly "resort chic" or the Ritz Carlton.

I HATE being away from my garden also...I take copious notes every day and take a look at my 1400 pepper plants and about 300 "strictly sauce & drying" tomatoes (husband grows all kinds of weird ones...) I am not happy unless I am getting dirty...raised on a working cattle ranch and have worked outside, with my hands in all kinds of weather my entire life. When I can no longer do this, I have no idea how I will stand it (I sympathize with Dr. Carolyn Maye, noted tomato guru & author who can no longer grow her own...)

Anyway, I am just an average (well...maybe more manic LOL) gardener like everyone else... Okay...vented my spleen...managed not to use any cuss words or insult anyone...one of my better days!


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Just because I've never known another gardener like you doesn't mean I'm not extremely impressed with your accomplishments and the diversity of your passions (as if my opinion warranted serious consideration!- but you do seem to be responding to my posts).

I'm just personally incapable of sustaining more than one obsession at a time.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Brokenbar has saved me much time with tomatoes pointing out the best to use for sauce and such. Much like this forum has helped with other fruits. Hman, Olpea, fruitnut saved me years of trial and error. And so has brokenbar. Thanks all. I have been growing plants for over 40 years, but not really fruits till the last few years. Only grapes have I grown for a long time. Anyway the experience of growing and with specific info from people here and other forums I have had great success. This year I had 11 tomato plants and harvested over 150 pounds of tomatoes. I calculated over 20 pounds per plant, but some produced a lot more. 3 were cherry tomatoes which were left off the calculations. The 3 cherry plants produced well over 1000 tomatoes. This is the 2nd time I ever had more than one plant. Each year yield is better as I learn. My wife was upset about all the plants at first, but just today she said she has been spoiled by having fresh garden food daily since May. That she will miss it. I have turned her around.I still have lettuce growing, and I just picked my last peppers today, so we still are having fresh food. The lettuce will be moved under a cold frame. I expect to have fresh lettuce till well into December.
The transition from house and tropical plants to fruit and vegetables has been extremely smooth, and easy really. I wish I would have done this 20 years ago!
I have always had a green thumb, growing difficult plants made the transition easier. Many vegetables are extremely easy to grow.
What really inspired me is when I took over the majority of cooking in 2009. Learning to cook demanded fresher product, the gardening naturally made sense and soon followed. I started cooking because in 2009 my wife broke both of her arms. I was forced to do everything. I never realized the work involved and it was unfair to her to make her do all the cooking. So I slowly have taken over.
I was a Med Tech so cooking was like sloppy lab work, easy compared to weighing out 1/100,000 of a gram. and other demanding lab techniques. So it turned out I was extremely good at it. Making a Cajun roux was easy compared to say extracting iron from hemoglobin, and weighing it. So even advanced cooking techniques were right up my ally.
Funny, my wife cooks using sight, and taste whereas I use weight and time. I guess from my lab work? She asked me the other day how do you steam broccoli and every time it's not too hard, or too soft, always perfect? Time, baby time, conditions are always the same, you only need to figure out exact time. She pokes it with a fork to test tenderness, I know it's done in 8.2 minutes. :)
Anyways thanks you guys, you made gardening a lot easier for me, and it is much appreciated!


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by olpea zone 6 KS (My Page) on
    Thu, Nov 6, 14 at 8:26

" I calculated over 20 pounds per plant, but some produced a lot more."

Great production!

I didn't get half that from my tomatoes, but I had some pretty serious issues this year. Bindweed is becoming more and more of a problem, and this year I got what I suspect may be late blight on the tomatoes at the farm.

Of all fruits, I believe the tomato is my favorite. I know that sounds strange since I have a peach orchard, but we actually eat quite a bit more tomatoes than peaches. Most summer evenings our family eats a big bowl of tomatoes for supper, plus we eat lots of tomato based salsa.

I do most of the cooking for our family too :-)


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

So many varieties of tomatoes to try, just for fun. Olpea, you are one of the nicest people here, I'm really glad we met, you have given me as much good advice as anybody here. So you have around 300 peach trees? Brokenbar Olpea is to peaches as what you are to peppers and tomatoes. I have 3 trees whip-tee-do!

Daily harvest looked like this, well a lot more cherries, maybe 30 a day, just a few in there for looks.
 photo 002-11.jpg

The plants did produce really well
 photo 003-8.jpg

Here's one of the last harvests. I pulled ones off not quite ripe due to weather.
 photo 001-17.jpg


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

My tomato production far exceeded any in the last 15 years here, not so much new varieties as exceptionally good conditions that featured almost no early blight for the first time in memory. I thought at first it was because I started spraying regularly with copper but other growers around are have experienced the same amazing season.

There is one new variety called "Country Taste" that claims to have the flavor of an heirloom. I think this is an exaggeration but the production of perfect, crack free tomatoes on extremely vigorous vines made every other variety I grow seem anemic by comparison.

During peak I was getting probably 20 pounds per week from one huge plant- many of the tomatoes were huge. When I have time I will post a picture of a cluster of 5 tomatoes from this plant each about a pound. Truly amazing, but the result of the variety much more than the competence of the grower.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Thu, Nov 6, 14 at 10:02

So many varieties of tomatoes to try, just for fun. Olpea, you are one of the nicest people here, I'm really glad we met, you have given me as much good advice as anybody here. So you have around 300 peach trees? Brokenbar Olpea is to peaches as what you are to peppers and tomatoes. I have 3 trees whip-tee-do!

Daily harvest looked like this, well a lot more cherries, maybe 30 a day, just a few in there for looks.
 photo 002-11.jpg

The plants did produce really well
 photo 003-8.jpg

Here's one of the last harvests. I pulled ones off not quite ripe due to weather.
 photo 001-17.jpg


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew! OMG what fabulous tomatoes! I need new soil. My raised bed produced poorly this year, as we had blight, (a real bummer) and cool temps all summer long. Not our best tomato year. The cherries were the only ones that produced like crazy. Every other plant had maybe six tomatoes each! Good going! Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Thu, Nov 6, 14 at 10:52

I like growing the heirlooms just for the fact you can save seeds that come fairly true. But yeah disease is always an issue, so one should have some hybrids to make sure you get something. I have 2 reasons to grow, cherry tomatoes for fresh eating. Mostly my wife. And tomatoes for sauce. I grow some slicers just for fun, but most end up in the sauce. We hardly ever use tomatoes for eating, just cherries. But I do like to eat some, just not many. Next year will be three heirloom cherry tomatoes (this year the three cherries were hybrids, 2xSungold, Sunsugar-both fantastic, some cracking but production was so huge, so what if a few cracked). I would like to find some heirloom cherries so I never have to buy again. Some look excellent like Snow White, Black Cherry, and numerous others.
And the rest will be hybrid pastes, artisan OP's and Italian heirloom pastes/sauce tomatoes
Open pollinated tomatoes are far from dead. I want to also grow next year a few of the new open pollinated types from the new breeders. Like Artisan seeds, I want to try Purple Bumble Bee, also Wild Boar Farms has some excellent tomatoes. The open pollinated tomatoes have amazing diversity. At Wild Boar I want to try Pink Tie die. Both these companies have had excellent reports from growers to quality disease resistance and most of all flavor. Not only do these tomatoes look nice, that are great tasting. The ones mentioned especially.
I'm not growing all of them next year but I bought from Wild boar

Berkeley Tie-Dye, Pink
Amos Coli
Cascade Lava
Michael Pollan
Pork Chop
Sweet Carneros Pink

Some links to check out
http://www.rareseeds.com/purple-bumble-bee-tomato/
http://www.johnnyseeds.com/c-983-artisan-tomatoes.aspx
http://shop.wildboarfarms.com/TOMATO-SEEDS_c3.htm
http://store.growartisan.com/

.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew, the company I'm about to suggest to you has an odd name but a glorious selection of seeds. I order from them every year. It is The Italian Tool and Seed company! Order Cuore de Bui. You will not be disappointed! Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

I've been growing tomatoes in the northeast for 25 years. When I first started I could harvest perfect beefsteaks into Nov by throwing some plastic over the plants in Sept- the leaves would stay healthy and plants vigorous through Sept. Then early blight arrived and everything changed. Plants will just start to ripen fruit and then begin to die. You usually get a rush of tomatoes that are perfect then quality rapidly declines as plants succumb to blight.

For quite a few years I've grown several variety of heirlooms and have found a couple that are fairly productive even in the face of blight but things vary here a great deal year to year now. Many small commercial growers have resorted to growing heirlooms under plastic because that is the only reliable way to assure productivity. Serious home growers too.

I won't go to that much trouble for tomatoes, but this year was the best tomato year in probably 15 years. I first thought it was because of the weekly applications of copper I applied but it was a banner year for many growers here in the southeast NY area with many experiencing a major reduction in blight damage.

Around here the hot item is heirlooms grafted to the roots of more vigorous varieties, but that is also too much trouble for me, although there are several mail order nurseries that offer them. Things like Purple Brandywine on Better Boy roots.

I think a better deal is to grow Burpie's Brandy Boy which is a hybrid combining Better Boy with Brandywine, creating the flavor of the latter on a more productive, vigorous plant.

If you want to grow what is hands down the most vigorous and productive beefsteak variety I've ever ever grown, get some Country Taste seeds somewhere. At peak I must have been harvesting 20 pounds a week from one obscenely huge plant. I'm still eating ones I picked green about 3 weeks ago. It reminded me of the beefsteak plants I used to grow, but more tomatoes. Not quite as tasty as a really good heirloom though, but so, so much more productive than any I've tried.

For the most productive cherry- that would be Sun Gold or one of its improved strains. Silly sweet with almost no acid. Fun to browse but I prefer a real tomato. Many people think it's the best thing since sugar enhanced sweet corn though. Now that I can't stand.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

I've grown SunGold and It cracks where I am worse than others it seems. Brandy Boy is slowly turning into my only Beef steak I grow. It is the best of both worlds! I bought a Brandywine grafted on a more disease resistant root stock and the Brandy Boy still did better.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

A newer version of Sungold that is crack resistant, but even sweeter is called Sunsweet. Same vigor and still almost as early and last to stop bearing. I like the flavor of Sungold better (it's already more than sweet enough) but near ripe fruit does crack when it rains.

Two of my other favorites are Speckled Roman and Rose.


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

I love Sungold! Don't care if they crack either. Last summer I also tried Sunsweet? (I think) it was too sweet, I love acid in tomatoes. Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Drew, here is a Brazilian pepper site that has some hard to find stuff: http://www.pimentasartesanais.com.br/default.asp

I had been looking for Murupi for a long time (I need to cultivate a "friend" in Brazil!!!)

One Brazilian Rand is about 35 cents US


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Hey Drew! Start a tomato and pepper thread. Mrs. G


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Brokenbar,

I have a cousin who lives in Brazil and travels here on a regular basis.

No promises, but tell me what you might want and I will pass it along.

Mike


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RE: Expectations v/s Patience!

Thanks Mike! I have looked and looked for Malaguetinha .
It is not malagueta. I appreciate you trying. Mary


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